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Currently it would not catch that 4chan thing as they only scan things that are uploaded to icloud photos. So you'd have to click on it and save to photos. This is the current implementation. I would guess that once they have their hooks in though all files with an image extension/header will be scanned and reported.
Send it via WhatsApp where it gets added to photos and later iCloud by default if I recall correctly
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> they wouldn’t and couldn’t care any less what the data on their servers Except they're legally forced to care. Thats why this is happening at all. They have a legal obligation to care, encryption be damned. They chose to preserve encryption instead of preserve trust.
they really don't though. no one can force them to scan a user for anything, however if they do scan and spot CP then obviously they have a duty to report it. Just like you have a duty to report child abuse if you're a teacher. No scans, no CP, no issues. This has been forced on them by the government by some means I think, either the US government or the CCP.
IANAL and could be wrong.
Personally I don't see on device scanning as significantly different than cloud scanning. I think the widespread acceptance of scanning personal data stored on the cloud is a serious mistake. Cloud storage services are acting as agents of the user and so should not be doing any scanning or interpreting of data not explicitly for providing the service to the end user. Scanning/interpreting should only happen when data…
Can you expand upon what you mean by "feels different because you supposedly own the device"? Just want to get a clearer idea of what you're saying. How does it feel?
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That is technically true but in a real very practical sense everyone here using OSS absolutely is trusting a third party because they are not auditing every bit of code they run. For less technical people there is effectively zero difference between open and closed software. It’s really disingenuous to suggest that open source isn’t dependent on trust, you just change who you are trusting. Even if the case is someone…
> Even if the case is someone else is auditing that code, you’re trusting that person instead of the repository owners. Suppose Debian's dev process happened at monthly in-person meetings where minutes were taken and a new snapshot of the OS (without any specific attribution) released. If that were the case, I'd rankly speculate that Debian devs would have misrepresented what happened in the openssl debacle. A claim…
Most people don't care to follow the controversies of tech unless it becomes a tremendously big issue, but even then, as we've seen here, there are plenty of people that simply don't have the technical acumen to really do any meaningful analysis of what's being presented to them and are depending on others to form their opinion, whether that be a friend/family member or some tech pundit writing an article on a major news organization's website.
Trusting Apple presents a risk to consumers but I'd argue that for many consumers, this has been a reasonable risk to take to date. This recent announcement is changing that risk factor significantly, though in the end it may still end up being a worthwhile one for a lot of people. Open Source isn't the be all end all solution to this, as great as that'd be.
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How is it any more ‘bit flips’ away from scanning every photo on your device than it was before?
Because if (willBeUploaded) { scanPhoto(); } can become if (true) { scanPhoto(); } Obviously, this is stupidly oversimplified, I have no idea how Apple has structured their code. But the fact of the matter is, if the scanning routine is already on the phone, and the photos are on the phone, all anyone has to do is change which photos get scanned by the routine...
This whole ‘now that they have a scanner it’s easier’ reasoning doesn’t make sense. iOS already had numerous better matching algorithms if your goal is to do general spying.
Don't use cloud services or closed-source services if you want your stuff to be safe and you want your privacy to be maintained.
Er, do you have a recommendation for non-cloud services that provide me with automatic backups of everything I do if something happens to my apartment, or open-source services that are free of all security flaws allowing hackers to compromise your privacy? Like I wholeheartedly get where you're coming from, but I'm not sure what realistic alternatives look like.
Perhaps the fundamental flaw in thinking behind this tactical error is that Apple thinks of your iPhone as their iPhone.
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By the way they already scan photos that aren’t uploaded to iCloud. I’ve never used iCloud and I can go on the photos app and search for food for example
Exactly. They already analysed photos on your phone for search . They don’t in fact do CSAM detection on the photos on your phone. But why are people only objecting now when they were already doing on-device analysis? CSAM detection is a complete red herring. It is less of a general purpose scanning mechanism than the search function that was already there.
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Yes, thats exactly how i feel. I'd still hate it if my iCloud uploads are scanned but I'm already assuming that anyway. But the fact that my iOS device can potentially report me to any authorities, for whatever reason, is crossing a line that makes it impossible to ever own an iPhone again. I bought my first one in 2007 so I'm not saying this lightly.. Does anybody know if this policy will extend to macOS too?
It has already be announced, this is not only iOS, but all Apple devices.
- Communication safety in Messages
[…] This feature is coming in an update later this year to accounts set up as families in iCloud for iOS 15, iPadOS 15, and macOS Monterey.*
- CSAM detection
[…] To help address this, new technology in iOS and iPadOS will allow Apple to detect known CSAM images stored in iCloud Photos.
- Expanding guidance in Siri and Search
[…] These updates to Siri and Search are coming later this year in an update to iOS 15, iPadOS 15, watchOS 8, and macOS Monterey.
There are two things that make me think this will be walked back. Firstly, and most importantly, this kind of backdoor is the kind of thing that makes big corps prohibit the use/purchases of devices. Secondly, it seems rife for abuse: dont like someone who uses an ios device, msg them some cp and destroy their entire life.
>dont like someone who uses an ios device, msg them some cp and destroy their entire life. For this to work one would have to send multiple photos and convince the other person to save the photos to their library.