European Parliament approves copyright reform • Hacker News Board

Re: European Parliament approves copyright reform

#301

Post by rmind » Tue, Mar 26, 2019, 2:20 PM UTC

golergka wrote: post #288

montenegrohugo wrote: post #241

A big part of the problem is that there is no single entity that defends the citizens interest in this instance. You have the Disney's of the world heavily lobbying to pass reforms like these, but who protests against it? - Online signatures? Gets laughed out of the room. They could be fake, they don't mean anything, they are paid, etc.. - Voting? Voting cycles are too long and voting decisions cannot be made on a si…

You could vote for your country to exit EU.

It is not the EU which is the problem. It is the reluctance of the political establishment (both within the countries and across the EU) to acknowledge the opposition to such laws.

Re: European Parliament approves copyright reform

#302

Post by dingaling » Tue, Mar 26, 2019, 2:20 PM UTC

I_am_tiberius wrote: post #116

Humanity did not change since WW2. The one big difference is/was the Internet. Without a free Internet, who knows what happens. It is unbelievable.

You can still communicate freely with your European colleagues. Take a photo, send it in an IM. Chat about politics.

What you can't do is claim that uploading a rip of Generic Marvel Action Movie VIII is 'communication'.

Re: European Parliament approves copyright reform

#303

Post by scurvy » Tue, Mar 26, 2019, 2:21 PM UTC

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #158

paganel wrote: post #130

> France’s current batch of national politicians have consistently advocated for the worst parts of the Directive, and the Macron administration may seek to grab an early win for the country’s media establishment. Macron is a crook. If any other president from any other civilized country would have sent the military to guard against its citizens' street protests [1] then that president would have been (rightly) calle…

> If any other president from any other civilized country would have sent the military to guard against its citizens' street protests [1] then that president would have been (rightly) called out the worst names Burning cars and breaking windows isn’t peaceful protest. If that happened in New York and the mayor and governor didn’t deploy armed guards, up to and including the National Guard, many people would be rightf…

France has many levels of police, too. Most countries have similar federations as in your US example. In France, the CRS is a reserve force of the national police who specialize in crowd and riot control. If you've ever been to a sporting event in Paris (or a train station during one) you'll see dozens of CRS there keeping order. And they're not the actual military.

Re: European Parliament approves copyright reform

#304

Post by philpem » Tue, Mar 26, 2019, 2:22 PM UTC

skrebbel wrote: post #193

I_am_tiberius wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You mean "It's poorly democratic" and not "It's purely democratic", right?

I'm seriously baffled about the amount of HN commenters, who I'd assume are highly educated, who think that democracy doesn't work if they don't agree with every law produced by it.

The difficulty is when the elected representatives decide unilaterally to pursue their own goals and aims, putting party before country and constituents.

As evidenced by Merkel and Voss's reported comments (which were in the Wired article on this): "The protesters are a bunch of people Google paid off to protest. Every one of them has a pay cheque".

Which to me sounds a lot like the oft-quoted line from the other side: "George Soros is bankrolling this".

Re: European Parliament approves copyright reform

#305

Post by jonny_eh » Tue, Mar 26, 2019, 2:24 PM UTC

vedantroy wrote: post #272

Funes- wrote: post #76

This will be an unpopular perspective on the matter, so you have been warned: Article 13 only affects for-profit platforms that host and share copyrighted material. These platforms are run by big corporations that turn a huge profit by way of selling your personal data, violating your privacy, and having a persuasive (addictive) design in order to glue you to the screen so they can maximize their ad revenue, dismissi…

I don't know whether Article 11/13 are good or bad (although at first glance they seem to be bad), but I don't think this attitude of "forcing freedom" onto others is good. The entire attitude that I should "regain [my] freedom" seems condescending. I don't want to use a P2P alternative to YouTube or Reddit, because 99% of the content is on Reddit/YouTube. I'm well aware that YouTube collects and sells my personal da…

YouTube doesn't sell your data.

Re: European Parliament approves copyright reform

#306

Post by phatfish » Tue, Mar 26, 2019, 2:24 PM UTC

piokoch wrote: post #39

I am curious how this will affect Brexit. At some point it looked like public opinion in UK leaned against it. Right now it seems that EU is ready to pass any law which is pushed by a powerful lobby, even if this law is not the most well-thought idea like Article 11 and 13. This does not make EU better place to be in. In fact if Germany and France agree on something, this going to happen. I don't think that UK will a…

Please, play damaging economic games with your own country not mine. No one cares about this in the UK right now, we are far more worried about the meltdown of our government and their attempts make us all poorer with the Brexit madness.

It is immeasurably more complicated than "I'm sure everyone will want to trade with the UK!". This is exactly the sort of line is expect to hear from the fanatics here.

Re: European Parliament approves copyright reform

#307

Post by Juliate » Tue, Mar 26, 2019, 2:24 PM UTC

tremon wrote: post #280

Juliate wrote: post #211

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One could even argue that this could trigger a new wave of self-hosting/publishing.

Probably not, as self-hosters are disproportionately affected by spurious or malicious copyright claims (they don't have the pooled resources to fight).

That's precisely why there are societies of authors, editors, publishers, etc. => in part in order to protect from malicious claims.

Re: European Parliament approves copyright reform

#308

Post by lagadu » Tue, Mar 26, 2019, 2:24 PM UTC

sprash wrote: post #124

isostatic wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem here is that the backroom deal of two states (California and New York) now has influence over states that are totally unrelated like e.g. Wyoming. This turns the US into a tyranny where might is right. Why should Californians have a say about how the internet should work in Wyoming? (The reality of course is that the US has had not only a say, but often the only say in how the internet should work in the…

I never said that the US is a great example for a functioning democracy. The best example for democracy is Switzerland. It also has the highest standard of living in the world as a result.

Surely you're aware that Switzerland is close to implementing broadly the same law?

Re: European Parliament approves copyright reform

#309

Post by goblin89 » Tue, Mar 26, 2019, 2:25 PM UTC

adrianN wrote: post #172

stiangrindvoll wrote: post #49

Could this directive speed the creation and adaptation of distributed technologies? If the topic of uploading to centralized cloud entities is just removed or ignored all together.

Somebody has to own the computers. You can sue those people if they don't comply with the law.

With well-implemented and sufficiently widespread P2P there’d be too many people to sue.

(I can’t name a strong contender in the wild currently, but I would also hope that this regulation, if successfully implemented, catalyzes some progress in this direction as a side effect.)

Re: European Parliament approves copyright reform

#310

Post by philpem » Tue, Mar 26, 2019, 2:26 PM UTC

piokoch wrote: post #39

I am curious how this will affect Brexit. At some point it looked like public opinion in UK leaned against it. Right now it seems that EU is ready to pass any law which is pushed by a powerful lobby, even if this law is not the most well-thought idea like Article 11 and 13. This does not make EU better place to be in. In fact if Germany and France agree on something, this going to happen. I don't think that UK will a…

I wouldn't be the slightest bit surprised if it pushes a chunk of the tech-savvy youth vote towards "Brexit at any cost".

As I said elsewhere on this story -- the EU has possibly just handed Eurosceptic parties a massive win in certain demographics they've had trouble making inroads into.