Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

We are Poles, so, of course, we print in Latin

ustc.ac.uk

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

31–40 of 93 posts

Re: We are Poles, so, of course, we print in Latin

#31

Post by michaelscott »

Tade0 wrote: post #26
asibahi wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m confused. Why not start the conversation in Polish?

He didn't know the nationality of the man in front of him as he's never seen the faces of the two before. It was the mid 90s, so it's not like he could easily look that up. Also he figured it would be rude. IIRC the wider context is that my dad, not knowing where the priests were at that moment and having no one to ask in the vicinity, went to a confessional as he saw someone there.

But why wouldn't he start the conversation in Polish? If the priest responds, he is Polish. If he doesn't, he is Spanish.

Re: We are Poles, so, of course, we print in Latin

#32

Post by tremon »

graemep wrote: post #15
snowpid wrote: post #6

As a side note I do think Latin language should be become the official language of the EU. It's dead so - its a compromise for all member staes - you can change as you like - it was used millennials as a law language so it fits

I think that is a reason the catholic Church still uses it for things like papal encyclicals. It puts different groups on a more equal footing. Far more people understand it than things like Esperanto. Quite a lot of people know it a bit. I did it at school. My kids learned some (their choice to do it up to GCSE level). That said, in practice, English is the international language. It is what is most likely to be use…

English is the international language now. About a century ago, the lingua franca of the technological world was German. Half of my father's university text books were in German, pretty much all of mine were in English. Things can (and do) change.

Re: We are Poles, so, of course, we print in Latin

#33

Post by celebril »

alexdbird wrote: post #11
tecleandor wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Giving the mass in Latin wasn't (generally) done because people understood Latin, but because of a traditionalist sense. The Second Vatican Council stated (among other things) that the mass could be done in other languages apart from Latin, and that it was a good thing to use local languages, so people could understand it better. After that Council some excisions appeared, like the Society of Saint Pius X, that recla…

You can't deny it, mass is much more stylish in Latin ;)

It's only stylish because of the imagined qualities of prestige vested in a language you're not fluent in. It's the same as how you get English-speaking people realising how cringe-inducing anime dialogue really is when they hear it in English instead of Japanese, and then championing "the only REAL way of consuming anime is in Japanese dub!", not realising the Japanese used in that is also extremely cringey.

People finding the mass somehow less holy and sacramental when celebrated in their native tongue need to reflect on their own perspectives on what makes something holy.

Re: We are Poles, so, of course, we print in Latin

#34

Post by pndy »

krzyk wrote: post #22

What is strange, that medical matters are mostly translated to Polish, while when I watch medical shows on TV I see that US still tends to use Latin there. Similar thing for species names, not sure where I've seen it. A side note from Polanmd: My professor of Solids State Physics was pretty fluent in both Latin and Greek, which I find quite interesting (it was about ~20 years ago, he was in his 60-70s).

My sister had her diagnosis described in Latin in the early 90s by CZMP hospital in Łódź

Re: We are Poles, so, of course, we print in Latin

#35

Post by celebril »

bombcar wrote: post #5
comrade1234 wrote: post #3

My grandfather emigrated from Vilnius (was polish at the time) to the USA as a teenager and managed to find a church that did their mass in Latin, and still does to this day. I assume he understood it but I'm not sure - he was well-educated and spoke a few languages.

The church Latin used in “the Latin Mass” is relatively simple and pretty easy to learn; and it’s very rare to find one that does the readings and homily in Latin; most of those are in English (or the local language) even at an FSSP parish. Of course if it’s “really” done in the ancient way then it’s done at such a high speed that you need five or six Jesuits and advanced recording equipment to even figure out what i…

[dead]

Re: We are Poles, so, of course, we print in Latin

#36

Post by oersted »

graemep wrote: post #14
tecleandor wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Giving the mass in Latin wasn't (generally) done because people understood Latin, but because of a traditionalist sense. The Second Vatican Council stated (among other things) that the mass could be done in other languages apart from Latin, and that it was a good thing to use local languages, so people could understand it better. After that Council some excisions appeared, like the Society of Saint Pius X, that recla…

Historically Latin was also a common international language. Educated people could understand Latin across much of Europe. Not so great for the majority of people, of course. The article seems to indicate that in some places it was pretty widely understood. I think some rites of the church did use other languages such as Syriac. I knew about SSPX but not the Palmarians. They seem to be even odder and a cult. Interest…

Indeed, it was also the lingua franca (pun intended) of early science for quite a long time.

Re: We are Poles, so, of course, we print in Latin

#37

Post by iso1631 »

mostertoaster wrote: post #23
somenameforme wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not just Europe. Well into relatively modern history educated individuals in America were expected to have fluency in Latin and frequently Greek as well. This [1] Harvard admission exam from 1869 immediately comes to mind. Applicants were expected to be able to pass that test, and the overwhelming majority did. [1] - https://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/pdf/education/harvard...

The classical school movement in America is growing quite rapidly, and so maybe we start to see it again? My kids at least are all learning Latin, and later, Greek.

Classical greek and modern greek are quite different

Re: We are Poles, so, of course, we print in Latin

#38

Post by shadowtree »

expedition32 wrote: post #2

I remember reading 17th century letters from Dutch diplomats. They used French to write back home- except when they talked about money. Such matters required a higher form of communication.

Lingua Franca, like literally. French used to be the language of diplomacy.

Re: We are Poles, so, of course, we print in Latin

#39

Post by shadowtree »

kmac_ wrote: post #13
snowpid wrote: post #6

As a side note I do think Latin language should be become the official language of the EU. It's dead so - its a compromise for all member staes - you can change as you like - it was used millennials as a law language so it fits

Or Esperanto. But Spanish or Italian would also be great as they sound so nice.

Esperanto being created by L.L. Zamenhof ... a Polish Ashkenazi Jew. Full circle!

Re: We are Poles, so, of course, we print in Latin

#40

Post by oersted »

mostertoaster wrote: post #23
somenameforme wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not just Europe. Well into relatively modern history educated individuals in America were expected to have fluency in Latin and frequently Greek as well. This [1] Harvard admission exam from 1869 immediately comes to mind. Applicants were expected to be able to pass that test, and the overwhelming majority did. [1] - https://graphics8.nytimes.com/packages/pdf/education/harvard...

The classical school movement in America is growing quite rapidly, and so maybe we start to see it again? My kids at least are all learning Latin, and later, Greek.

In Spain both are still taught in the standard high-school curriculum.

Not everyone takes those classes of course, but Latin is one of the core optatives in the humanities path, it can be chosen in the university entrance exam as one of the core tests, and many students do pick it.

It's not really taught as a foreign language though, it is used to teach fundamental concepts in linguistic analysis and translation, and it can be a legitimately valuable foundation to have a strong general literacy across romance languages.

I'm not sure how common it is elsewhere, but Roman law also makes up a non-trivial fraction of the compulsory curriculum in the first years of studying law at university. Most of the concepts are still relevant, it's what all modern legal systems are founded on.

I remember that a good friend of mine somehow avoided studying maths for the last four years of high-school by choosing all the alternatives, which included both Latin and ancient Greek. He was and still is a fantastic programmer despite hating maths though, obsessed with Linux distros from early teens.

Post reply on HN