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Apple loses UK App Store monopoly case, penalty might near $2B

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Re: Apple loses UK App Store monopoly case, penalty might near $2B

#31

Post by ocdtrekkie »

stavros wrote: post #24
ocdtrekkie wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think both third party app stores (without aggressive scare screens) and third party payments will be globally available on both platforms in the next few years. But it will take some time for enough piecemeal jurisdictions to require it for it to become burdensome for the companies to have different options in different regulatory regimes, and to make it no longer worth blocking in jurisdictions which haven't rule…

Yeah but Apple always required signing, and Google is moving to that too, so they can simply charge you an exorbitant amount to get your app signed, moving the money maker from the store to the dev environment.

Now that the regulators are actually saying this is a problem I suspect these schemes will be addressed much faster. I'm pretty stunned Google announced that just after losing the case, because it's so remarkably stupid. Judges do not like being screwed with.

Re: Apple loses UK App Store monopoly case, penalty might near $2B

#32

Post by bigyabai »

JimDabell wrote: post #27
ocdtrekkie wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know, but when every single business on the planet has to pay you 30% for access to mobile device users, it definitely isn't.

> when every single business on the planet has to pay you 30% for access to mobile device users That doesn’t describe Apple’s situation though. Most businesses don’t distribute software at all; those that do mostly don’t need to distribute native iOS apps; those that do mostly don’t need to pay App Store fees; those that do mostly have to pay 15%. It’s only a fraction of a fraction of a fraction of a fraction that ne…

All those percentages are arbitrary, none of them are set through natural competition.

Good on the UK for not backing down. 15% or 150%, Apple should not be exempted from participating in a true market economy.

Re: Apple loses UK App Store monopoly case, penalty might near $2B

#33

Post by crims0n »

bitpush wrote: post #16
crims0n wrote: post #11

Honest question, what do people think is a fair percentage? The platform development, app hosting, payment processing, and quality control is surely worth something .

This question is valid only if Apple lets apps host their own apps, bring their own payment system. Apple bans all such activities, has held the entire app ecosystem and seeks rent. If they think their offering is superior, then they should be OK competing. The fact that they have not opened it up says that they are happy to overcharge. Remember, competition is always good. Let Stripe and Apple duke it out on payment…

So in this scenario would Epic then need to develop and maintain their own toolchain and SDK for their app store? The development tools and education are also worth something, Epic shouldn’t get that for free.

Re: Apple loses UK App Store monopoly case, penalty might near $2B

#34

Post by doctorpangloss »

crims0n wrote: post #11

Honest question, what do people think is a fair percentage? The platform development, app hosting, payment processing, and quality control is surely worth something .

Your list is missing, "concentrating rich payers into one channel," which is why developers pay 30%, even if they don't like it.

Re: Apple loses UK App Store monopoly case, penalty might near $2B

#35

Post by stavros »

ocdtrekkie wrote: post #31
stavros wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah but Apple always required signing, and Google is moving to that too, so they can simply charge you an exorbitant amount to get your app signed, moving the money maker from the store to the dev environment.

Now that the regulators are actually saying this is a problem I suspect these schemes will be addressed much faster. I'm pretty stunned Google announced that just after losing the case, because it's so remarkably stupid. Judges do not like being screwed with.

I really hope so, because I was hoping Apple would be forced to be more open, and was surprised that, instead, Google got more closed.

Re: Apple loses UK App Store monopoly case, penalty might near $2B

#36

Post by raincole »

bigyabai wrote: post #19
jjtheblunt wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do web pages accessed from (for example) Safari cost the publisher 30% of a subscription fee, when a subscription might be established off mobile first?

How are web pages analogous to installing mobile software, in this particular example?

In every single aspect of "business on the planet enabling access to mobile device users".

Re: Apple loses UK App Store monopoly case, penalty might near $2B

#37

Post by lukeschlather »

crims0n wrote: post #33
bitpush wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This question is valid only if Apple lets apps host their own apps, bring their own payment system. Apple bans all such activities, has held the entire app ecosystem and seeks rent. If they think their offering is superior, then they should be OK competing. The fact that they have not opened it up says that they are happy to overcharge. Remember, competition is always good. Let Stripe and Apple duke it out on payment…

So in this scenario would Epic then need to develop and maintain their own toolchain and SDK for their app store? The development tools and education are also worth something, Epic shouldn’t get that for free.

Epic has a toolchain and SDK for their own app store. So does Valve, and many other competitors, and Apple won't let them install their toolchain on iOS.

Re: Apple loses UK App Store monopoly case, penalty might near $2B

#38

Post by jen729w »

crims0n wrote: post #33
bitpush wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This question is valid only if Apple lets apps host their own apps, bring their own payment system. Apple bans all such activities, has held the entire app ecosystem and seeks rent. If they think their offering is superior, then they should be OK competing. The fact that they have not opened it up says that they are happy to overcharge. Remember, competition is always good. Let Stripe and Apple duke it out on payment…

So in this scenario would Epic then need to develop and maintain their own toolchain and SDK for their app store? The development tools and education are also worth something, Epic shouldn’t get that for free.

Dystopian story plot:

Apple completely opens up the iOS platform. Do whatever you like.

Also, an XCode license is now $20,000/year. Don’t like it? Build your own.

Re: Apple loses UK App Store monopoly case, penalty might near $2B

#39

Post by bigyabai »

raincole wrote: post #36
bigyabai wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How are web pages analogous to installing mobile software, in this particular example?

In every single aspect of "business on the planet enabling access to mobile device users".

No? Websites are a subset of the software market, not the other way around. Apple can absolutely monopolize software distribution while providing a web browser.
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