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New Mexico is losing a form of Spanish spoken nowhere else

nytimes.com

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Re: New Mexico is losing a form of Spanish spoken nowhere else

#31
post #11
post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Via a class system. US movies imply you have the same thing over there.

Every language group has a hierarchy of accents, often roughly corresponding to wealth. There is usually a prestige accent used by the wealthy, and which the upper classes mimic. And everyone looks down on rural people, marked by their accent. It's worse in some places than others but it's practically universal.

[deleted]

Re: New Mexico is losing a form of Spanish spoken nowhere else

#32
post #9
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The lowest of the low? Based on consonant pronunciation? How can you extract a value judgment from how someone speaks?

There's a bit of "accentism" in Spain. Speaking with a southern accent will (wrongly) mark you as "lazy", "uncultured" or "unsophisticated" to some people. I was born in Castile, so I usually speak "accentless" standard Spanish, but my mother comes from Extremadura, just a couple hours drive to the south, and when I speak to her I involuntarily switch to the extremaduran accent. I don't notice it but other people hea…

Slightly off topic but your reference to being accentless reminds me of a time as a 14 year old visiting my American cousins for Ireland.

My slightly younger cousin’s friend found the way I pronounced things as well as some of my vocabulary to be very funny. When I pointed out that he also had an accent he almost almost wet himself with laughter, so absurd was the idea to him that both of us had accents rather than the one of us who didn’t sound American.

Re: New Mexico is losing a form of Spanish spoken nowhere else

#33
post #4
post #3

[flagged]

The lowest of the low? Based on consonant pronunciation? How can you extract a value judgment from how someone speaks?

Ask anyone who has a "hillbilly" accent how they're treated by "educated" people.

Re: New Mexico is losing a form of Spanish spoken nowhere else

#34
post #15
post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a bit of "accentism" in Spain. Speaking with a southern accent will (wrongly) mark you as "lazy", "uncultured" or "unsophisticated" to some people. I was born in Castile, so I usually speak "accentless" standard Spanish, but my mother comes from Extremadura, just a couple hours drive to the south, and when I speak to her I involuntarily switch to the extremaduran accent. I don't notice it but other people hea…

I have never heard of Castilian Spanish referred to as "accentless" before. The lisp always sounds odd to me. That and vosotros. The vast majority of Spanish speakers worldwide use neither.

Spanish/español is also called castellano. That gives a clue as to what the standard is (not that it is better or worse than any other dialect)

Re: New Mexico is losing a form of Spanish spoken nowhere else

#35
post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The lowest of the low? Based on consonant pronunciation? How can you extract a value judgment from how someone speaks?

Ask anyone who has a "hillbilly" accent how they're treated by "educated" people.

Interestingly, I have often seen in movies with hillbilly characters dubbed to Spanish, their accent is dubbed in andalusian accent. I alway found it quite offensive.

Re: New Mexico is losing a form of Spanish spoken nowhere else

#36
post #16

Nowhere else... just the whole South of Spain. At least the aspiration.

>words drawn from English and languages indigenous to North America. >thought to be Tlaxcalan Indians, who spoke Náhuatl, the lingua franca of the Aztec Empire. Why would a dialect of Spanish in southern Spain have indigenous native American words?

Because "imports" of foreign goods. All of them, from the Pyrenees to Patagonia. From chocolate to cacahuete to who knows how many more kinds of food.

Re: New Mexico is losing a form of Spanish spoken nowhere else

#38
New Mexico Hispanic culture is quite different from a lot of the rest of the US. And the rural areas were very isolated for a long time. So it has some other interesting historical Spanish cultural variants. A couple:

The Penitentes, an ascetic Catholic group. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Penitentes_(New_Mexico)

The Crypto-Jews, usually thought to be a hundreds-years-old vestige of Judaism fleeing the Inquisition. The truth is probably more complicated. https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2000/12/mistake...

New Mexico is also home to a bunch of different Native American languages and cultures, many of which did not have the trauma of being forced to move to new land and thus have a different relationship with their history.

(This post feels clumsy of me, apologies if as an outsider I mis-characterized something.)

Re: New Mexico is losing a form of Spanish spoken nowhere else

#39
post #16

Nowhere else... just the whole South of Spain. At least the aspiration.

>words drawn from English and languages indigenous to North America. >thought to be Tlaxcalan Indians, who spoke Náhuatl, the lingua franca of the Aztec Empire. Why would a dialect of Spanish in southern Spain have indigenous native American words?

It is the exception, rather than the rule, but there are two Nahuatl words that have been borrowed widely to other languages.

They can be found in a recognizable form even as far away as Finnish, Korean, Indonesian, Japanese and Emoji.

Chocolate from Xocolatl

Tomato from Tomatl

Re: New Mexico is losing a form of Spanish spoken nowhere else

#40
This is my dialect! We’ve always attracted linguists because of our unique mix of cultures. For instance, we have lots of words for turkey - guíjalo/guajalote (and various combinations of the two), pavo, ganso real, cócono, and yes, even torque.
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