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Stanford’s President and Provost Must Resign

theymustresign.substack.com

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Re: Stanford’s President and Provost Must Resign

#31

Post by tedivm »

havblue wrote: post #18

"President Tessier-Lavigne’s administration might be playing a role in causing student deaths." A lot of the article discusses the conflict of interest of her side business but I didn't personally see any points that led me to believe she actually caused people to kill themselves.

Her job is to prevent deaths- it's literally why they hired her. By focusing on her side hustle she has neglicted her own job, which has lead to a statistically large increase in deaths. This has been brought up to the administration and they've ignored it. That sounds like the administration is "playing a role"- by not addressing the problem they are letting it grow.

Re: Stanford’s President and Provost Must Resign

#32

Post by behnamoh »

Animats wrote: post #22
Bud wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because it got X votes in X amount of time. Like every other post here. Why should it not be on the front page?

Aw, it's been flagged. It's kind of relevant to HN, if only because there are a large number of Stanford alums in the VC and startup community.

I think it more has to do with the fact that HN is not typically a place for propaganda or petitions.

Re: Stanford’s President and Provost Must Resign

#33

Post by tedivm »

guyintreecost wrote: post #30
havblue wrote: post #18

"President Tessier-Lavigne’s administration might be playing a role in causing student deaths." A lot of the article discusses the conflict of interest of her side business but I didn't personally see any points that led me to believe she actually caused people to kill themselves.

Quoted post unavailable.

The author is talking about their own experiences. They aren't attempting to be journalists- they are documenting what they went through, and all of the associated facts around it. The author is the one who filed the ethics complaints, and the author was directly retaliated against by the university and the dean herself. He is now telling everyone about the situation.

Claiming that the person is "everything that's wrong with journalism today" is just bad faith garbage that shouldn't be allowed on this site.

Re: Stanford’s President and Provost Must Resign

#34

Post by dopamean »

dlandis wrote: post #19

I'm not familiar with this situation, but this is such an immaturely written post. For example, the third bullet point in the summary is: > On March 1, 2022, Stanford student Katie Meyer died by suicide. During that time, Dean Caldera was running a raffle for her side consulting business. What is the writer trying to imply, exactly? Are they suggesting that there is something inappropriate about the raffle? Or was th…

I don't think they're just implying it. They say in the post that it seems that Caldera's side hustle is getting in the way of doing her actual job.

Re: Stanford’s President and Provost Must Resign

#35

Post by tedivm »

behnamoh wrote: post #32
Animats wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Aw, it's been flagged. It's kind of relevant to HN, if only because there are a large number of Stanford alums in the VC and startup community.

I think it more has to do with the fact that HN is not typically a place for propaganda or petitions.

> HN is not typically a place for propaganda

You talking about a different site? This place has a huge amount of VC Propaganda.

Re: Stanford’s President and Provost Must Resign

#36

Post by shkkmo »

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #27
shkkmo wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The article provides quite a few specific failures that specifically relate to the deaths. Is there a specific reason you are ignoring those details?

Not sure we read the same article. New processes and offices to help with student stress - a response to increased stress and chance of suicide. That wasn't done vigorously enough to prevent all incidents. Of course in prior administrations there was no such office, and a much lesser rate of student stress and depression. Different situation. Sure the President is ultimately responsible. But not for the deaths - for…

> Not sure we read the same article.

I read the article, I'm not sure why you aren't sure you read the article.

There are numerous, specific complaints about specific actions, conflicts of interest, and misconduct, not just a general "not pressing reforms fast enough".

Edit: I don't claim to know the truth behind these allegations, but the allegations themselves are quite clearly more the "not pressing reforms fast enough" and trying to cast them in that light does not appear to be good faith discussion.

Re: Stanford’s President and Provost Must Resign

#37

Post by weberer »

tedivm wrote: post #29
weberer wrote: post #3

>In another case, a student used the word “suicide” over 100 times in an essay. That student later died and the death was classified “an accident” by President Tessier-Lavigne’s administration. That's really up to the police to decide, isn't it? There's a lot of important info being omitted about this example.

Stanford has its own police department. So they investigated themselves and decided the most convenient thing for them was the truth. They also didn't address, at all, the fact that the "accident" could have been prevented. The way the RA/RD handled that situation would have gotten him immediately fired at the school where I was an RA, and that's before even touching on the other lawsuit against him.

What exactly was the accident?

Re: Stanford’s President and Provost Must Resign

#39

Post by JoeAltmaier »

shkkmo wrote: post #36
JoeAltmaier wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not sure we read the same article. New processes and offices to help with student stress - a response to increased stress and chance of suicide. That wasn't done vigorously enough to prevent all incidents. Of course in prior administrations there was no such office, and a much lesser rate of student stress and depression. Different situation. Sure the President is ultimately responsible. But not for the deaths - for…

> Not sure we read the same article. I read the article, I'm not sure why you aren't sure you read the article. There are numerous, specific complaints about specific actions, conflicts of interest, and misconduct, not just a general "not pressing reforms fast enough". Edit: I don't claim to know the truth behind these allegations, but the allegations themselves are quite clearly more the "not pressing reforms fast e…

Sorry to give that impression.

My whole comment was intended to convey that the furor sounds like generalized criticism of a President, almost unrelated to the specific problems that occurred. All too common nowadays, to just fling criticism and claims around and hope something sticks, with no honest attempt to connect to the tragedy.

Sure conflicts of interest are concerning. How does that get a student into a bathroom with a drug overdose? And so on.

Re: Stanford’s President and Provost Must Resign

#40

Post by shkkmo »

JoeAltmaier wrote: post #39
shkkmo wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Not sure we read the same article. I read the article, I'm not sure why you aren't sure you read the article. There are numerous, specific complaints about specific actions, conflicts of interest, and misconduct, not just a general "not pressing reforms fast enough". Edit: I don't claim to know the truth behind these allegations, but the allegations themselves are quite clearly more the "not pressing reforms fast e…

Sorry to give that impression. My whole comment was intended to convey that the furor sounds like generalized criticism of a President, almost unrelated to the specific problems that occurred. All too common nowadays, to just fling criticism and claims around and hope something sticks, with no honest attempt to connect to the tragedy. Sure conflicts of interest are concerning. How does that get a student into a bathr…

The criticism is pretty specific:

> In sum, 1) An internal Stanford document finds repeated failure by Stanford staff, 2) Both Giammalva and Madarasz quietly depart Stanford, 3) Giammalva has been accused of past misconduct, and 4) the Dean overseeing all this, Lisa Caldera, has been the subject of an ethics complaint. Despite this, President Tessier-Lavigne’s administration released a public statement in January 2022 chastising the lawsuit from two Stanford faculty over their dead son and called any criticism “unfounded.”

> These are no isolated incidents. On March 7 2019 Stanford cyclist Kelly Caitlin died by suicide in what was her second suicide attempt that year. Between the first suicide attempt and the second one, Stanford denied Kelly access to two psychologists she requested on campus.

> President Tessier-Lavigne’s administration responded in an unsigned letter that I believe was designed to mislead regulators. The letter lies about the date of certain events, lies about the materiality of events, lies about the nature of events, lies by omission, and created a fiction to deceive regulators.

> Not only did President Tessier-Lavigne’s administration deceive WSCUC regulators, but the two and only original investigative case notes that provided a direct glimpse into the matter were destroyed and forged.

So, take the contrast between the difficulty that students have getting help from her when it is her main job to help them, vs how easy it is to her "side hustle" clients to reach her:

> On the intake form for Caldera College Consulting, customers can suggest time availability Monday-Sunday in the Morning, Midday, Afternoon, and Evening. On Instagram Dean Caldera has also shared a direct deposit link to her Venmo bank account so customers have “an easy way to connect to my services.”

vs:

> Mental health at Stanford is an afterthought. The administration’s neglect is single-handedly responsible for my breakdown. I spent 45 minutes on hold with [Stanford] during an emergency trying to get help before my parents rushed to get me.

> I got upset and hung up on the crisis line. They didn’t call back or follow up in any way.

> “No help when we needed it — had to fly out from the East Coast to save my son myself.”

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