Live data from Hacker News

Russia asks Google to clamp down on Navalny′s ‘Smart Voting′

m.dw.com

31–40 of 62 posts

Re: Russia asks Google to clamp down on Navalny′s ‘Smart Voting′

#31

Lovely theatre to pretend the outcome isn't rigged already.

Election rigging is a finite resource. After certain amount regime loses it's legitimacy. This in turn creates a regime phase transition, which in certain scenarios could be not fatal (as Belarus and Venezuela examples shows us), but very painful for the elites and increases all sorts of risks, especialy for current incumbent.

Also there are investors, external and internal, which are too all over risks, this damages economy and national currency.

Re: Russia asks Google to clamp down on Navalny′s ‘Smart Voting′

#32
Eventually there's a time where corporations, like individuals have to decide what's important, putting their money where their mouth is as it were. What matters more to Google, profit or accessibility of information. Issues like these highlight those choices.

Re: Russia asks Google to clamp down on Navalny′s ‘Smart Voting′

#33
post #32

Eventually there's a time where corporations, like individuals have to decide what's important, putting their money where their mouth is as it were. What matters more to Google, profit or accessibility of information. Issues like these highlight those choices.

Google doesn't care about the accessibility of information, they care about their politics and that's why, like other SV companies, they were very upfront about their support to certain causes and candidates. The problem is that when it comes to other countries they got no clue about the politics of the place and they don't even know who they want to support. I am sure once they figure out who are the "baddies" they are going to censor them without even a slight regard to accessibility of information.

Re: Russia asks Google to clamp down on Navalny′s ‘Smart Voting′

#34
post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't see it as being less principled then, it's just a less simplistic principle.

I think strong principles are by their definition simplistic. As soon as you start having multiple clauses and subclauses, they become weak - and sometimes transparent.

[deleted]

Re: Russia asks Google to clamp down on Navalny′s ‘Smart Voting′

#35
post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That depends on just how fine-grained their control on the election is. They might not lose, but they could still be embarrassed or greatly inconvenienced by the results. And you don't always need to chip away at the armor too much before a critical weakness is revealed. Once the party is no longer viewed as unassailable things could change more rapidly. I'll admit that's a very optimistic view of things though. It h…

Vladivostok is one place in Russia where Putin genuinely struggles to get even single digits of approval ratings. It's one of the only places in Russia a jury acquits a person 3 times, just for him to finally get jailed for the 4th. 2018 token provincial elections had Lutun's candidate lose despite ABSOLUTELY MASSIVE fraud. And yet they still pulled this at the end: https://meduza.io/impro/LCjzlLaaoQX5pld_zlmxXqom_TR…

> Vladivostok is one place in Russia where Putin genuinely struggles to get even single digits of approval ratings.

Citation needed.

In the last election in Primorsky Kray Putin got 65% up from 57% in the previous election. Pretty much the lowest in the country, but far from the single digits you claim.

https://regnum.ru/news/polit/2394633.html

Even Levada approval polls (pro-opposition “foreign agent”) shows he is the most popular politician (although they don’t provide a breakdown by region).

https://www.levada.ru/2021/02/04/prezidentskie-rejtingi-i-po...

Re: Russia asks Google to clamp down on Navalny′s ‘Smart Voting′

#36
post #20
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I sometimes wonder... Do the leaders of such corrupt states think that is a better way to run things, and if so why? I might guess it's as simple as "anything else would be worse for me personally" but that seems to simplistic for a guy like Putin. And if they dont think it's better, then why not change it? Inertia? Backlash? Don't know how to get there from here?

> anything else would be worse for me personally" No, that's mostly it. Along with an enjoyment of power and control and the suffering of others for its own sake. He's built a multi billion dollar palace, he's not going to risk losing power.

That's the oversimplification that wraps things up nicely and doesn't require digging any deeper. Like when people think Kim Jong Un is necessarily just a madman without realizing that playing the madman is the perfect defense against outside interference. Give up their nukes? Ukraine did that, they even have a signed treaty with Russia for this. Iran signed a piece of paper with the US too. That turned out well for everyone who is a superpower.

Authoritarianism isn't required to get richer than you could otherwise as an already powerful person. Look at democratic countries (all still having a measure of corruption) where having slightly more money and power than most people gives you access to huge wealth and immunity from the law, a positive feedback loop where money begets money.

Did the Sacklers need to be crazy dictators to get even richer while throwing a wad of cash at the government in exchange for full immunity? Regular people get civil asset forfeiture but for rich people there no law to find them guilty and take back all the money, the only way is to negotiate a consolation settlement? Obviously lobbying for donations or plain old influence peddling will get you incredibly far, maybe even further than dictatorship.

Putin doesn't need this level of authority to stay rich and powerful as a former member of the intelligence community. He needs it because he has grandiose dreams of Russian imperialism, bringing them back to former superpower glory after seeing that the post USSR breakup times and trying to integrate into the Western world made them play fifth fiddle. This needs the authoritarianism because Russia is lacking the other quality of life elements to afford selling the "glory" aspect to people.

It's like deciding to be the CEO of your own company rather than the middle manager in somene else's even if the pay is the same. Only your employees are stuck suffering there.

Re: Russia asks Google to clamp down on Navalny′s ‘Smart Voting′

#37
post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Vladivostok is one place in Russia where Putin genuinely struggles to get even single digits of approval ratings. It's one of the only places in Russia a jury acquits a person 3 times, just for him to finally get jailed for the 4th. 2018 token provincial elections had Lutun's candidate lose despite ABSOLUTELY MASSIVE fraud. And yet they still pulled this at the end: https://meduza.io/impro/LCjzlLaaoQX5pld_zlmxXqom_TR…

> Vladivostok is one place in Russia where Putin genuinely struggles to get even single digits of approval ratings. Citation needed. In the last election in Primorsky Kray Putin got 65% up from 57% in the previous election. Pretty much the lowest in the country, but far from the single digits you claim. https://regnum.ru/news/polit/2394633.html Even Levada approval polls (pro-opposition “foreign agent”) shows he is t…

> In the last election in Primorsky Kray Putin got 65% up from 57% in the previous election.

Yes, and in 1927 Liberian general election Charles King received around 240,000 votes (out of 15,000 registered voters). So what?

Re: Russia asks Google to clamp down on Navalny′s ‘Smart Voting′

#38
post #32

Eventually there's a time where corporations, like individuals have to decide what's important, putting their money where their mouth is as it were. What matters more to Google, profit or accessibility of information. Issues like these highlight those choices.

yes, but on a municipality by municipality basis because geofences and switch statements are free

Re: Russia asks Google to clamp down on Navalny′s ‘Smart Voting′

#39
post #32

Eventually there's a time where corporations, like individuals have to decide what's important, putting their money where their mouth is as it were. What matters more to Google, profit or accessibility of information. Issues like these highlight those choices.

In this case, profit and accessibility of information go hand in hand: if Google does not comply with the government, Google does not get to exist in Russia.

Re: Russia asks Google to clamp down on Navalny′s ‘Smart Voting′

#40

What would the legal process look like if the app were made by anonymous unaffiliated Russian developers and merely recommended by Navalny? Perhaps Google would be required to hand over the personal information associated with the developer account, because presumably a judge could be "convinced" to issue a warrant for this information based on the theory that the developers were secretly working for Navalny's organi…

deceased person

Or just a homeless one, as it’s usually done for $100 or less. The risk here is not a personal data leak (it will leak because it was a bank payment that google cannot legally deny or hide), but that the investigation will eventually trace everyone involved, regardless of a name on the card.

Post reply on HN