Earlier quoted context omitted.
It seems in this space actually delivering something takes out the magic and reduces valuation. Remember Magic Leap? Much better to push vaporware and cash out.
Or solar-freaking-roadways.
Who IPOed that idea?
Rivian Files for IPO, Seeking About $80B Valuation
31–40 of 42 posts
Re: Rivian Files for IPO, Seeking About $80B Valuation
#32Earlier quoted context omitted.
That's exactly how it works. If you buy a house for $500k and have a $300k mortgage do you say the house is only worth $200k?
Not OP but.. There’s a difference between debts and assets though. Is the $160B debt equivalent to $160B in assets or did they screw up and overspend? If I bought a $500k for $1M then the next buyer can’t get it appraised for such
Especially if the house is theoretical, like Rivian’s products.
Re: Rivian Files for IPO, Seeking About $80B Valuation
#33Earlier quoted context omitted.
I loved this tweet by Ross Gerber "So that makes tesla worth $8 tril by these metrics." https://twitter.com/GerberKawasaki/status/143129811631815884... Some valuations are truly difficult to grasp.
Nearly all valuations are difficult to grasp at this point. We're _way_ overdue for a _massive_ correction. Surprised Pikachu faces incoming.
Make money and take profits while you can?
Re: Rivian Files for IPO, Seeking About $80B Valuation
#34Earlier quoted context omitted.
That's exactly how it works. If you buy a house for $500k and have a $300k mortgage do you say the house is only worth $200k?
Not OP but.. There’s a difference between debts and assets though. Is the $160B debt equivalent to $160B in assets or did they screw up and overspend? If I bought a $500k for $1M then the next buyer can’t get it appraised for such
The amount owed to the creditors doesn’t change in that scenario. The screw up (assuming the market recognizes it) would destroy value for the equity holders.
Another way to think about total enterprise value is that there are two groups of people who have a claim on the business: the equity holders and the creditors. In order to own the business free and clear, you need to buy both of their claims. The total equity claim is the market cap and the total creditor claim is the outstanding debt.
Re: Rivian Files for IPO, Seeking About $80B Valuation
#35Why would this company IPO now instead of waiting to have actual customers with products in their hand? I can only speculate that investors are forcing their hand so they can cash out as soon as possible, because they don’t believe in the company’s long term performance. Will retail investors be left holding overpriced equity?
Re: Rivian Files for IPO, Seeking About $80B Valuation
#36Earlier quoted context omitted.
Not OP but.. There’s a difference between debts and assets though. Is the $160B debt equivalent to $160B in assets or did they screw up and overspend? If I bought a $500k for $1M then the next buyer can’t get it appraised for such
Especially if the house is theoretical, like Rivian’s products.
How are they theoretical? One literally drove past my house the other day when I was walking my dog. I found the headlights pretty amusing.
Re: Rivian Files for IPO, Seeking About $80B Valuation
#37Earlier quoted context omitted.
I mean, that's my exact point. If there is anything 2001 or 2008 taught the world, it's that the Fed will run the printing press full bore if there is a big downturn, so putting cash in your mattress is the absolute worst place for it to be.
It already did run it full bore for the past year and a half - US public is just not paying attention. At some point running it full bore will turn the US into Zimbabwe, currency-value wise. That will not reflect positively on the economy as a whole.
They have been buying up corporate bonds, which is not the same as printing money and spending it. They simply have to slow down and eventually stop buying bonds and as they are paid back, that money goes back of the ledger. I.e. it's destroyed.
Re: Rivian Files for IPO, Seeking About $80B Valuation
#38Earlier quoted context omitted.
Especially if the house is theoretical, like Rivian’s products.
How are they theoretical? One literally drove past my house the other day when I was walking my dog. I found the headlights pretty amusing.
Until it is sold and in the hands of objective parties, I assume it is theoretical.
Re: Rivian Files for IPO, Seeking About $80B Valuation
#39Earlier quoted context omitted.
Are we? I mean, where else are excess savings going to go? It's clear that every time stocks start to seriously pull back that the Fed just pumps out more money. At some point it seems like yes, stocks are overvalued, but I'd rather put money into something with productive capacity, as opposed to something like cash which more and more seems like it will just lose value faster.
"Excess savings" are going to panic and go to "the mattress" at some point, when it becomes clear "excess savings" are invested into a de-facto Ponzi scheme which has no bearing on the real world at all. See e.g. 2008 or 2001 before that.
Ok, so you claim rockets in space and change of whole industry to electric cars doesn't have impact on the world for example?
Re: Rivian Files for IPO, Seeking About $80B Valuation
#40Why would this company IPO now instead of waiting to have actual customers with products in their hand? I can only speculate that investors are forcing their hand so they can cash out as soon as possible, because they don’t believe in the company’s long term performance. Will retail investors be left holding overpriced equity?
Most likely