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German environmental groups file objection against Tesla gigafactory permit

reuters.com

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Re: German environmental groups file objection against Tesla gigafactory permit

#31

Post by the-dude »

martin_a wrote: post #9
Kovah wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am grateful that Musk has a really long breath, because not only environmental groups but alos government officials made this project so much more difficult than it should be. The gigafactory will bring thousands of jobs but.. yeah... there some small f*king spider or whatever insect in that area that needs to be protected at all costs! you can only shake your head at this.

If you were that spider... You'd be happy if someone was trying to take care of you. Change your perspective.

Does your empathy extend to plants and bacteria too? Rats? Cockroaches?

Uhhhh, bats?

Re: German environmental groups file objection against Tesla gigafactory permit

#32

Post by user-the-name »

eplanit wrote: post #19
hyperdunc wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Environmental groups file objections against every single major project in democratic countries, where it's their right to do so. Occasionally, the objection is worthwhile.

And, every time, the objections drive up costs and delay results.

So does not destroying the environment.

Sometimes, we do not want to keep costs and delays down.

Re: German environmental groups file objection against Tesla gigafactory permit

#33

Post by WanderPanda »

fuzzy2 wrote: post #21

It’s difficult to strike a balance between hysteria and justified skepticism. Especially with topics like electric cars. However, I believe this isn’t really about the environment. It’s about corruption, real or imaginary. People are afraid that companies, especially big companies, have it all too easy with the bureaucratic process, while individuals or small companies are stonewalled at every turn. If it makes munic…

Funnily it is because of these objections and the other bureaucratic stuff that Tesla is able to pull this of (building pre permit etc.) and has the publicity to „make it work“ because if the project fails it would shed a bad light on Germany for other investments. Smaller projects don‘t have that privilege. Kind of a Cobra Effect situation

Re: German environmental groups file objection against Tesla gigafactory permit

#35

Post by shlant »

WanderPanda wrote: post #25

From first hand experience I know that these „environmental“ groups are also big in blocking smaller projects like wind turbines. In the end they are ultra conservative but can paint themselves in a modern, green way

are you referring to specific groups involved with the Tesla gigafactory?

Re: German environmental groups file objection against Tesla gigafactory permit

#36

Post by newsclues »

dewey wrote: post #10
tut-urut-utut wrote: post #4

Environmental groups file objections against every single major project in Germany. That's probably one of the reasons why major infrastructure projects in Germany never finish on time. I'm all for environment, but sometimes these complaints are just for complaint's sake.

> The objection is based on the claim that Tesla has not sufficiently clarified what precautions it will take to prevent highly poisonous gas from escaping from the factory, the objection document showed. This seems like a pretty reasonable objection and not just "complaints are just for complaint's sake".

What evidence is there that it is a serious problem?

Re: German environmental groups file objection against Tesla gigafactory permit

#37

Post by gmueckl »

dewey wrote: post #10
tut-urut-utut wrote: post #4

Environmental groups file objections against every single major project in Germany. That's probably one of the reasons why major infrastructure projects in Germany never finish on time. I'm all for environment, but sometimes these complaints are just for complaint's sake.

> The objection is based on the claim that Tesla has not sufficiently clarified what precautions it will take to prevent highly poisonous gas from escaping from the factory, the objection document showed. This seems like a pretty reasonable objection and not just "complaints are just for complaint's sake".

Environmental activists and other groups opposed to major construction projects in Germany have a tendency to latch on to even the most minor potential issue and complain and sue. The strategy, as far as I can infer it, is to delay the project and drive costs in the hope that it will have to be abandoned. It rarely works, but in combination with long and arduous processes for building permits, major construction projects can be held up in the planning phase for 10 to 20 years these days.

The Tesla factory is a huge exception, mostly because Tesla went ahead using temporary permits and took the risk that the final permits may be denied. The project has a lot of political support, which also helped the process along.

Re: German environmental groups file objection against Tesla gigafactory permit

#38

Post by esyir »

shlant wrote: post #26
eplanit wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And, every time, the objections drive up costs and delay results.

and many people are realizing that the environment should be considered over costs and deadlines

Until the frivolous complaints get them an image of obstructionism and people start to ignore them. Boy who cried wolf, after all.

Re: German environmental groups file objection against Tesla gigafactory permit

#39

Post by tut-urut-utut »

reader_mode wrote: post #24
tut-urut-utut wrote: post #4

Environmental groups file objections against every single major project in Germany. That's probably one of the reasons why major infrastructure projects in Germany never finish on time. I'm all for environment, but sometimes these complaints are just for complaint's sake.

Wouldn't surprise me at all if the competition (VW and the likes) were nudging these groups. They often end up being shills and proxies.

That would actually create an equal playing field, given how easy German companies get finned in the USA.

This just shows how big protectionisms is that domestic companies enjoys in every country. We all talk about free competition, but somehow Monsanto needs to pay huge fines in the USA as soon as it became a German company, while VW enjoys full protection in Germany and Europe, while being heavily punished in the USA.

Re: German environmental groups file objection against Tesla gigafactory permit

#40

Post by major505 »

tut-urut-utut wrote: post #4

Environmental groups file objections against every single major project in Germany. That's probably one of the reasons why major infrastructure projects in Germany never finish on time. I'm all for environment, but sometimes these complaints are just for complaint's sake.

Meanwhile, in the name of enviroment, germany gets away of cleaner energy alternatives like Nuclear and increases its dependencies of outside sources of natural gas to keep the country going.

I feel that most environmental groups today are more like a religion with dogmas then people trying to do whats best for environment .

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