Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

macOS 11 (Big Sur) Compatibility News

support.native-instruments.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

31–40 of 72 posts

Re: macOS 11 (Big Sur) Compatibility News

#31

Post by alacombe »

slmjkdbtl wrote: post #28
alacombe wrote: post #23

which begs the question... Is backward compatibility dead ? People are rejoicing when developer updates their app "fast" to support new OS, but once upon a time, one wouldn't even expect to have to update anything at all , just because "new OS version". You can easily run Win 95 app on Win 10. I can run a CNC controller built for WinXp, controlling very destructive equipment on Win7 without issue, and I've been using…

It's just buggy, not dead. However there should be a point when backward compatibility should be dropped, if you want to keep maintaining a sane codebase and interface, or force a "better" way of doing things. When Apple deprecated OpenGL and moved to Metal, I hated it but I actually respected a lot, cuz Metal does have a superior design, and by deprecating old technology they're forcing devs to use this better techn…

> It's just buggy, not dead. However there should be a point when backward compatibility should be dropped, if you want to keep maintaining a sane codebase and interface, or force a "better" way of doing things.

Not when millions of people rely on working computers, and as much third party peripherals.

Re: macOS 11 (Big Sur) Compatibility News

#32

Post by wahern »

bigbubba wrote: post #13
tialaramex wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As I understand it the Kontrol S4 has moving parts (essentially motors) under USB control. Obviously you could design this sensibly so that no legal inputs result in malfunction let alone damage, but that might cost more, so, do it all in software right? And then you're at the mercy of the software and anything (such as the OS kernel) which that software depends on. We do teach Computer Science / Software Engineering…

Sounds like a nightmare, I guess SANE is an ironic name?

IIUC, that example seems more like an indictment of the scanner manufacturers, not the developers of SANE. SANE includes that code because some manufacturers didn't implement such a simple, obvious, and crucial constraint in the hardware. Unless maybe the poster's point was that the SANE developers shouldn't try to support such fundamentally broken hardware?

Re: macOS 11 (Big Sur) Compatibility News

#33

Post by hungryforcodes »

TaylorAlexander wrote: post #4
buildbot wrote: post #3

Maybe this is cruel, but in some ways I’m surprised modern hardware can be damaged over a modern bus? I wonder how it damages them.

The device that can be damaged is a DJ controller with haptic feedback. So it has motors in it, and some kind of audio outputs. If the audio levels get turned to maximum or the motors get sent invalid commands, it could cause the device to damage itself. I’d call it a firmware problem if the motors can be commanded to move too fast, but anyway it may be reason for them to warn their customers. The editorialized hacke…

I’m not sure why you’re getting downvoted. This is a totally succinct summary of the situation.

Re: macOS 11 (Big Sur) Compatibility News

#34

Post by oarsinsync »

Fordec wrote: post #19
vvanders wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are those of us who are "self-taught" who are familiar with Therac-25 and other incidents. Don't think that a college degree somehow magically infuses engineers with ethics and judgement. That comes from a culture of engineering that focuses on learning and continuous improvement, otherwise we'd just be fixed in time the moment we left school.

I can't speak for other degrees, but mine didn't magically infuse me with ethics. It was the full credited modules solely dedicated to just ethics that aided in that department.

Ethics was an elective module in my CS degree. I took it because it seemed easier than some of the more advanced programming courses. 20 years later, I’m glad for the choice I made as a lazy youth.

Re: macOS 11 (Big Sur) Compatibility News

#35

Post by Aloha »

neya wrote: post #18
tialaramex wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As I understand it the Kontrol S4 has moving parts (essentially motors) under USB control. Obviously you could design this sensibly so that no legal inputs result in malfunction let alone damage, but that might cost more, so, do it all in software right? And then you're at the mercy of the software and anything (such as the OS kernel) which that software depends on. We do teach Computer Science / Software Engineering…

No hardware vendor would actually design that way. Pretty sure there are some driver ICs for those motors which take care of those spikes. Besides, controlling voltage limits via software is pretty expensive to do compared to just slapping a driver IC. The problem is most likely not the motors, but something else.

They do, and have, the Therac-25 as noting by the GP is a great example, but this kind of thing is still done, even often.

Re: macOS 11 (Big Sur) Compatibility News

#36

Post by innocenat »

coldtea wrote: post #25
alacombe wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Because every update usually also moves things forward. Just because something move forward doesn't means it moves in the right direction. > And because they still have the better OS/hardware combo. Do they ? How many brain-time did Apple waste yesterday by soft-bricking ALL THE DAMN MACS running Canalina ?

> Just because something move forward doesn't means it moves in the right direction. Sure. In this case though I meant "in the right direction" too. I, for one, welcome third party kernel extensions moving to userland. > Do they ? How many brain-time did Apple waste yesterday by soft-bricking ALL THE DAMN MACS running Canalina ? A little. Nothing like the brain-months I've wasted on Windows and Linux troubleshooting,…

Maybe I am doing something wrong here, but I use Windows for 10 years, then switch Ubuntu for 5, and Mac for less than a year right now (so I am on Catalina).

I feel that I spend 2-3x times troubleshoot my mac than Ubuntu. I still haven't been able to find a cause for intermittent entire UI froze I experience 2-3 times a day.

Re: macOS 11 (Big Sur) Compatibility News

#37

Post by adenylyl »

edub wrote: post #15

Does Apple have a "Release to Manufacturing" phase in their release schedule before the product is GA? A time for all their software and hardware partners to fully vet their product against the gold master.

There have been a series of beta releases since June. (For some reason, they say in the linked page that beta releases have only been available since August, but that's not correct).

Re: macOS 11 (Big Sur) Compatibility News

#38

Post by bfuclusion »

baldfat wrote: post #11

Why does Apple get the Professional OS nod when EVERY update is a break in your workflow Majorly. Heck every Mac is always on a different update because they are scared to even update in Mac only cooperate networks like mine. It has always been a pain in my video editing life too.

IMO 10.5 was peak OSX. Every other later one has smacked me upside the head with something going wrong.

Re: macOS 11 (Big Sur) Compatibility News

#39

Post by tialaramex »

bigbubba wrote: post #13
tialaramex wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As I understand it the Kontrol S4 has moving parts (essentially motors) under USB control. Obviously you could design this sensibly so that no legal inputs result in malfunction let alone damage, but that might cost more, so, do it all in software right? And then you're at the mercy of the software and anything (such as the OS kernel) which that software depends on. We do teach Computer Science / Software Engineering…

Sounds like a nightmare, I guess SANE is an ironic name?

SANE (Scanner Access Now Easy) is named that way because it does what people on minority platforms assumed TWAIN does on Windows / MacOS.

TWAIN (sometimes said to mean "Toolkit Without An Interesting Name") looks like it's a universal API for scanners, except, the mandatory parts just spin up a graphical user interface and that does all the actual work. There is no actual scanner technology in TWAIN, each scanner comes with its own GUI plus scanner driver bolted into one app.

So in TWAIN there is no API for like "Scan A4 document, 300dpi" only "Make whatever Twain GUI I have appear" and when you buy a scanner it just comes with a CD (I guess these days they tell you to download it probably? I have not set up a new scanner in decades) with the software on it.

But SANE does what people assumed TWAIN did, the GUI application software is neutral, and the code for driving scanners has APIs for scanning documents, because that makes more sense (and also, frankly, "reverse engineering USB code" and "building easy to use GUIs" are not the same skill set). As a bonus it means you can network SANE, just by adding an RPC layer, whereas for TWAIN you'd need like RDP or something. Blergh.

Re: macOS 11 (Big Sur) Compatibility News

#40

Post by pram »

lostgame wrote: post #26
cageface wrote: post #20

macOS updates almost always break a lot of audio apps. You're better off waiting a few point updates and checking with the vendors of the apps you use before upgrading.

I'm still running Mojave. Fuck 'upgrading' to an operating system that kills a ton of 32-bit VST plugins I paid for a decade or so ago that will probably never get updated, while adding no meaningful features of substance for me. I don't need a dark theme. I don't need to be able to answer calls from my iPhone on my Mac or whatever. I just need the software I have paid for, that has worked for 7 consecutive software…

>I just need the software I have paid for, that has worked for 7 consecutive software iterations, to continue to work.

This contrasted with your last sentence is amusing because it can be applied to 10.5 (no more CE) 10.6 (no more PPC hardware) and 10.7 (no more Rosetta)

Post reply on HN