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Others are speaking up about discrimination at Tesla

theguardian.com

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Re: Others are speaking up about discrimination at Tesla

#31

Post by [deleted] »

xbmcuser wrote: post #10
wiz21c wrote: post #3

Is it me or we are reading more and more about abuses ? So I'd say this or that company is not specifically problematic, but it's just women tend to be more vocal about the "difficulties" they encounter on the work place (I don't know how to express the fact that I think they are harassed but at the same time, being European, I'm not sure that what I have in mind is the same for those who read this; in my experience…

1.) More women are speaking out as they feel they have a voice. 2.) More women are in the higher positions so other women feel someone at the top will listen to them.

[deleted]

Re: Others are speaking up about discrimination at Tesla

#33

Post by tbabb »

davexunit wrote: post #21

Nearly all of the top-level comments thus far are disgusting and shameful. What is wrong with this place?

The topic of women and minorities in tech really provokes HN to display its neckbeard plumage. Really, I don't know why I click on the comments of these articles.

People in tech-- nerdy or socially insecure men in particular-- often tie their self worth to their jobs or their skills.

A mere whiff that the reason that they have their position isn't because they're innately better than everyone else threatens that sense of self worth, and a lot of them handle it by getting angrily defensive.

Re: Others are speaking up about discrimination at Tesla

#35

Post by npiazza83 »

davexunit wrote: post #21

Nearly all of the top-level comments thus far are disgusting and shameful. What is wrong with this place?

It is a community that curates discussion based solely on technical discourse of technical subject matters. When the matter is subjective people lose their minds because the only moderation standard is "off topic, subjective discussion. Detach thread!"

Re: Others are speaking up about discrimination at Tesla

#36

Post by araglia »

davexunit wrote: post #26
araglia wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fatigue of the subject possibly.

The subject will be brought up again and again until the issues are addressed.

You mean perpetually then? This is not a problem that will ever go away in general. So people get tired of it. I could share some stories my mom told me about her workplace experiences from the 70s to the 90s. They're much more disturbing than being passed over for promotion. So perhaps things have gotten better.

Re: Others are speaking up about discrimination at Tesla

#37

Post by ams6110 »

buckbova wrote: post #4

> We have had a few cases at Tesla where someone in a less represented group was actually given a job or promoted over more qualified highly represented candidates A few cases . . . unfortunately this is the world we live in, diversity over all else. Must be demoralizing to be that engineer passed over because they weren't in the right less represented group.

There are many many intangible reasons for choosing one qualified person over another (yes, even if one is somewhat more qualified). The engineer passed over will have other opportunities if he or she really is highly qualified.

Re: Others are speaking up about discrimination at Tesla

#38

Post by pixelcloud »

awinder wrote: post #22
0xbear wrote: post #2

I was wondering when the other shoe was going to drop. Now both of the "star" SV CEOs who had the gall to constructively engage with the administration are under fire for "harassment". I wonder how Thiel has managed to avoid these Alinsky playbook tactics so far. In any company of tens of thousands of people, you can always find a few people who are mistreated (even at such bastions of social justice as Google and Mi…

The fact that this comment hasn't been downvoted into oblivion yet (in fact, it may be the top comment on this thread right now) is galling. I'll go ahead and emphatically state that I did down-vote this, because chalking up someone being mistreated in the workforce to a coordinated liberal agenda will get you banned from the comment section on most real news websites, but apparently it makes you a fuckin' hero aroun…

OPs comment is so disconnected from the article its actually funny. That person did not read it.

Re: Others are speaking up about discrimination at Tesla

#39

Post by dleslie »

daenz wrote: post #28
dleslie wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the individual were under-performing then that would have been adequate reason to fire them; there would be no need to fire them in retaliation for making the accusation. It certainly would have been a better reason for Tesla to provide, should they care at all about the sensitivity of their public image. Do you have evidence to support your speculation?

>If the individual were under-performing then that would have been adequate reason to fire them Not if they had a claim of harassment, which is my point. Now any firing looks like retaliation, similarly to what is being claimed by Vandermeyden's lawyer. According to Tesla, she was fired for false accusations of harassment, as proven by an independent third party investigation (reported in the link). But because she m…

If an individual were genuinely under-performing, and the company were decently managed, then there would be a paper trail of feedback and attempts to rectify the situation which would indicate that the individual was not performing adequately.

Such a paper trail is what allows a company to defend itself in wrongful dismissal lawsuits. The sort of lawsuit that arises when an individual is wrongfully dismissed for non-existent performance reasons as a retaliation for other actions they took.

The individual is not, in any way, immunized from making false claims so long as Tesla is operating itself in a manner befitting a company of its size.

Re: Others are speaking up about discrimination at Tesla

#40

Post by daenz »

kartan wrote: post #30
daenz wrote: post #12

https://www.theverge.com/2017/6/1/15724520/tesla-fires-femal... >Tesla fired the female engineer who earlier this year publicly made claims about “unwanted and pervasive harassment” at the electric carmaker, according to The Guardian. Tesla says it was justified in firing the engineer, AJ Vandermeyden, because her accusations were false, but Vandermeyden’s lawyers allege that it amounts to retaliation. I don't mean t…

> it makes the most sense to allege some kind of harassment if you feel you are underperforming in your job and wish to get ahead That's true for men as much for women. But I have not seen that argument used for men. So, I don't say that you are discriminating against women, as I don't know if you use this argument also when we talk about men, but you should understand that without further information it looks like y…

I specifically used the words "protected class" in my statement, which covers: race, sex, pregnancy, religion, national origin, disability, age, military service, bankruptcy, genetic information, citizenship status, gender identity, sexual orientation.

Leveling thinly-veiled accusations of sexism ('it looks like you are telling us that "women" do this while "men" don't') is the reason why these topics don't advance from discussion.

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