Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Implications of AI to schools

twitter.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

291–300 of 447 posts

Re: Implications of AI to schools

#291

Post by bluefirebrand »

mavhc wrote: post #116
onion2k wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not great for the teacher though. They're the ones who will truly suffer from the proliferation of AI - increased complexity of work around spotting cheating 'solved' by a huge increase in time pressure. Faced with that teachers will have three options: accept AI detection as gospel without appeals and be accused of unfairness or being bad at the job by parents, spend time on appeals to the detriment of other du…

4. Use AI to talk to the student to find out if they understand. Tests were created to save money, more students per teacher, we're just going back to the older, actually useful, method of talking to people to see if they understand what they've been taught. You weren't asked to write an essay because someone wanted to read your essay, only to intuit that you've understood something

> 4. Use AI to talk to the student to find out if they understand

Personally I don't believe that any of the problems caused by AI are going to be solved by "more AI"

Re: Implications of AI to schools

#292

Post by CuriouslyC »

The answer to AI use in schools breaking old teaching and evaluation methods isn't to cripple students, it's to create new assignments and evaluation methods.

One idea: Have students generate videos with their best "ELI5" explanations for things, or demos/teaching tools. Make the conciseness and clarity of the video video and the quality/originality of the teaching tools the grading criteria. Make the videos public, so classmates can compare themselves with their peers.

Students will be forced to learn the material and memorize it to make a good video. They'll be forced to understand it to create really good teaching tools. The public aspect will cause students to work harder not to feel foolish in front of their peers.

The beauty of this is that most kids these days want to be influencers, so they're likely to invest time into the assignment even if they're not interested in the subject.

Re: Implications of AI to schools

#293

Post by alpinisme »

somenameforme wrote: post #203
ubj wrote: post #7

One of my students recently came to me with an interesting dilemma. His sister had written (without AI tools) an essay for another class, and her teacher told her that an "AI detection tool" had classified it as having been written by AI with "100% confidence". He was going to give her a zero on the assignment. Putting aside the ludicrous confidence score, the student's question was: how could his sister convince the…

I wouldn't mind seeing education return to its roots of being about learning instead of credentialization. In an age where having a degree is increasingly meaningless in part due to many places simply becoming thinly veiled diploma treadmills (which are somehow nonetheless accredited), this is probably more important than ever. This is doubly so if the AI impact extremists end up being correct. So why is the issue yo…

In a world where some but not all programs are “diploma treadmills,” you would expect that the reputation of the bad credentials would go down and the good credentials would go up. In some sense if the credentials were really being used (and not just as a perfunctory first pass elimination), you’d expect the most elite programs to have the highest signal to noise ratio. But the market doesn’t seem to respond to changes in credentialing capability (by hiring more from programs that start focusing on the “right” things to test). Instead it’s really just a background check.

Re: Implications of AI to schools

#294

Post by huevosabio »

raincole wrote: post #169
huevosabio wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When I was in college, there was a cheating scandal for the final exam where somehow people got their hands on the hardest question of the exam. The professor noticed it (presumably via seeing poor "show your work") and gave zero points on the question to everyone. And once you went to complain about your grade, she would ask you to explain the answer there in her office and work through the problem live. I thought i…

I think this kind of approach is the root of (the US's) hustle culture. Instead of receiving a fair score, you get a zero and need to "hustle" and challenge your teacher. The teacher effectively filtered out the shy boys/girls who are not brave enough to "hustle." Gracefully.

Nah, the professor wasn't American (as is often the case) and she had a tricky situation. She had strong reasons to believe people were cheating and had to sort out who did and who did not in a swift way.

This has nothing to do with American Hustle culture and just with that professor's judgment.

Re: Implications of AI to schools

#295

Post by watwut »

idiotsecant wrote: post #260
rgblambda wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not to mention there'd be at least a few students too timid to challenge the teacher, even if they knew they got it right.

That's a valid and useful lesson, especially for the shy students. Arguably, it's probably more important than whatever the question on the test was. The world at large rarely accommodates shy people. Coping skills are essential, even if they are unpleasant.

Except they did not learned to not be shy. There was no such lesson. This is like saying that stealing from a student is ok, because it is teaching them thieves exist.

They learned that cheating gives advantage to the cheating individual. They also learned that reporting cheating harms them and non cheaters.

Re: Implications of AI to schools

#296

Post by nicce »

fhgh2 wrote: post #266
nicce wrote: post #250

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oral exams don't scale well if there are +100 students and a lot of assignments. The main pain point.

Do fewer graded assignments then

Then learning targets only those assignments because students are the best optimizers.

Re: Implications of AI to schools

#297

Post by j45 »

bluefirebrand wrote: post #291
mavhc wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

4. Use AI to talk to the student to find out if they understand. Tests were created to save money, more students per teacher, we're just going back to the older, actually useful, method of talking to people to see if they understand what they've been taught. You weren't asked to write an essay because someone wanted to read your essay, only to intuit that you've understood something

> 4. Use AI to talk to the student to find out if they understand Personally I don't believe that any of the problems caused by AI are going to be solved by "more AI"

Technology doesn't solve the problems created by technology on it's own.

People do learn how to use the web, social media, mobile devices to ultimately work for them or against them.

Re: Implications of AI to schools

#298

Post by j45 »

rixed wrote: post #161
mavhc wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

4. Use AI to talk to the student to find out if they understand. Tests were created to save money, more students per teacher, we're just going back to the older, actually useful, method of talking to people to see if they understand what they've been taught. You weren't asked to write an essay because someone wanted to read your essay, only to intuit that you've understood something

I really believe this is the way forward, but how do you make sure the AI is speaking to the student rather than to another AI impersonating the student? You could make it in person but that's a bit sad.

You make it about the student and the material in all ways. There are teaching frameworks and methedologies that help.

Re: Implications of AI to schools

#299

Post by bo1024 »

ishtanbul wrote: post #91

Here is my proposal for AI in schools: raise the bar dramatically. Rather than trying to prevent kids from using AI, just raise the expectations of what they should accomplish with it. They should be setting really lofty goals rather than just doing the same work with less effort.

This is great for a “capstone project” at the end of a degree. But along the way, you have to master sub tasks and small skills in order to build on them later to accomplish lofty goals. So you need to learn the basics first. But AI is really good at helping you cheat on the basics without learning. So we still need to get them to the point of being able to use AI intelligently

Re: Implications of AI to schools

#300

Post by j45 »

WalterBright wrote: post #146
mavhc wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

4. Use AI to talk to the student to find out if they understand. Tests were created to save money, more students per teacher, we're just going back to the older, actually useful, method of talking to people to see if they understand what they've been taught. You weren't asked to write an essay because someone wanted to read your essay, only to intuit that you've understood something

> Tests were created to save money I'm skeptical. Tests are a way of standardizing the curriculum and objectively determining if the lessons were learned.

Tests are a way of largely seeing if a response to a question was memorized.

The lesson of how to swim sometimes only comes in applying the learning.

Post reply on HN