Liz Truss resigns as UK prime minister • Hacker News Board

Re: Liz Truss resigns as UK prime minister

#291

Post by andyjohnson0 » Thu, Oct 20, 2022, 2:03 PM UTC

T-zex wrote: post #273

cameronh90 wrote: post #245

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For all parliament's faults, it's still largely populated by well educated, intelligent individuals who are skilled orators and debaters. Even some of the most awful parliamentarians would easily talk circles around me in any kind of debate. For anyone not aware, a large number of our politicians come from a background at public schools such as Eton, and read Philosophy, Politics and Economics at Oxford. Institutions…

Did you mean private schools? Public school education in the UK is quite problematic.

> Did you mean private schools? Public school education in the UK is quite problematic.

Ita confusing. In the uk, private schools are referred to as "public schools". The last person to know the reason for this died in 1764. Probably.

Schools that the actual public go to are called "state schools" because they're funded by the state (and not by daddy's estate).

Re: Liz Truss resigns as UK prime minister

#292

Post by [deleted] » Thu, Oct 20, 2022, 2:03 PM UTC

FridayoLeary wrote: post #277

chrisseaton wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> they're doing in a way that feels somehow good-hearted and doesn't lay bare the naked resentment and hatred that seems to be all we have left in the USA It's nice that it looks this way, but the different parties and their supporters in the UK absolutely hate each other. Front-bench party members now routinely and openly using words like 'scum' and 'detest' to talk about their colleagues on the other side. I don't…

A lot of it is theatre. For example keir starmer congratulating boris on the birth of his child, i think, and sounding sincere. Then pretty much in the same breath, he lashes out at him on some policy or scandal. English people banter a lot more then americans, so its not taken personally.

[deleted]

Re: Liz Truss resigns as UK prime minister

#293

Post by iwillbenice » Thu, Oct 20, 2022, 2:04 PM UTC

usefulcat wrote: post #233

klelatti wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lost the confidence of the market for UK government debt pushing up borrowing costs for government and for others (as well as causing problems for pension funds who own that debt). She did this by launching a series of unfunded tax cuts and doing so without an assessment of the impact on the UK's finances.

> She did this by launching a series of unfunded tax cuts Another interesting difference between the US and UK. Republicans do this routinely in the US, and have done for many decades now. The last Republican president who didn't do this was George Bush (the first one). After promising "no new taxes" during his campaign, he later agreed to do the fiscally responsible thing and raise taxes in order to offset spending…

> After promising "no new taxes" during his campaign, he later agreed to do the fiscally responsible thing and raise taxes in order to offset spending increases.

That is an extremely charitable parsing of the events. The more accurate (realpolitik) version is Bush said the no new taxes quip, and Democrats subsequently laser-focused on making him (slightly) raise taxes, showing he is a "liar".

My take away is to learn not to promise overly optimistic outcomes when your political rivals have a significant stake in seeing you either be a success or a failure.

Edit: Not sure why this was flagged. Did not mean to come off as hostile or aggressive. Anyways, cheers.

Re: Liz Truss resigns as UK prime minister

#294

Post by gpderetta » Thu, Oct 20, 2022, 2:04 PM UTC

HelloNurse wrote: post #130

The forthcoming Italian government could last much less, with Silvio Berlusconi trying to achieve negative duration by alienating allies before a prime minister is nominated.

One can only hope.

Re: Liz Truss resigns as UK prime minister

#295

Post by UltraViolence » Thu, Oct 20, 2022, 2:05 PM UTC

domh wrote: post #88

Only 45 days in the post; shortest in UK history. She tanked the economy quicker than anyone before. It's quite impressive how you can mess up this bad. Borrowing money to pay for tax cuts for the rich... Unbelievable.

The sad part is that there's a can of worms just like her in the Conservative Party. She's merely the one that got sacked for it, but the next Tory PM will most likely have the same agenda, although he / she will most likely tread more carefully.

After leaving the EU the UK economy has become extremely unstable, with strikes occurring almost on a weekly basis, just like we had in the 60's and 70's before the UK became a EU member state.

Mind you that the UK isn't self-sufficient in terms of food (hasn't been for more than 120 years) and economic dire straits could actually lead to food shortages and famine!

Re: Liz Truss resigns as UK prime minister

#296

Post by pclmulqdq » Thu, Oct 20, 2022, 2:05 PM UTC

matthewmacleod wrote: post #203

pclmulqdq wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He, and many others, actually does seem to have the support of a lot of the party. Liz Truss didn't - she just had the support of the current party leadership. They made the mistake of putting up two incredibly unpopular candidates for PM to the party members in the most recent PM selection process. I'm not sure they will make the same mistake again. At the same time, they did just have an election, so it's not like…

He, and many others, actually does seem to have the support of a lot of the party. Liz Truss didn't - she just had the support of the current party leadership. This is pretty much the exact opposite of true – Truss had the support of the membership, and did not have the support of the "leadership" or the parliamentary party. Sunak was the other way round. At the same time, they did just have an election, so it's not…

They will definitely have a leadership election.

Lots of people here and labor-aligned folks in the UK want another general election.

Re: Liz Truss resigns as UK prime minister

#297

Post by nequo » Thu, Oct 20, 2022, 2:05 PM UTC

ShredKazoo wrote: post #275

This might sound crazy... but if the UK is already de facto ruled by financial markets, in the sense that the PM has to step down if the markets don't like what they're doing, maybe it's time to try prediction market-based governance for real? What would've happened if instead of simply announcing the proposal, Truss had described the proposal and the government had sponsored a conditional prediction market on the ec…

This is an interesting idea. Although if anyone has enough money to single-handedly move the market price, it devolves into a dictatorship of that person.

Re: Liz Truss resigns as UK prime minister

#298

Post by jeffbee » Thu, Oct 20, 2022, 2:05 PM UTC

Symmetry wrote: post #238

1) I really like that in the UK system if the leader is crazy the party can just kick them to the curb rather than basically having to support them even when they do terrible things. 2) The US system of open primaries where anybody can vote that we adopted in the 70s seems like a mistake in retrospect and there's a good reason no other country does things this way. The UK Conservative party's system, adopted in the 2…

Primary election participation varies by state. The U.S. does not have a blanket open primary system, and the federal government cannot adopt one without an amendment to the Constitution.

Re: Liz Truss resigns as UK prime minister

#299

Post by apexalpha » Thu, Oct 20, 2022, 2:05 PM UTC

ShredKazoo wrote: post #275

This might sound crazy... but if the UK is already de facto ruled by financial markets, in the sense that the PM has to step down if the markets don't like what they're doing, maybe it's time to try prediction market-based governance for real? What would've happened if instead of simply announcing the proposal, Truss had described the proposal and the government had sponsored a conditional prediction market on the ec…

This happens all the time. People close to any administration "leak" plans to the media to see how they land.

Not good? Just deny it. Good? Guess we go ahead.

Re: Liz Truss resigns as UK prime minister

#300

Post by bb123 » Thu, Oct 20, 2022, 2:05 PM UTC

sofixa wrote: post #201

bb123 wrote: post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He doesn't have any authority, in practice. It has been that way since 1414. The second the monarchy tried to exert control over politics would be the second it was abolished.

Charles exerted lots of control behind the scenes while he was Prince of Wales, lobbying, receiving lobbyists, getting inside information, accepting huge donations, etc.

Influence is not the same as authority. I'm sure he has influence - but then so do lots of people. And at least as public figure he has a degree of visibility. Governments don't exist in a vacuum.