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Google unveils Stadia cloud gaming service

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Re: Google unveils Stadia cloud gaming service

#291

Post by b_tterc_p »

diminoten wrote: post #217
b_tterc_p wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, I’ll give you that nothing is confirmed, but nobody has made this work yet. It’s mostly tech testing, so current business models aren’t a good metric. I’m open to debate about how this could be priced, but I’m pretty comfortable pointing to existing cloud computing business models or streaming services as a precedent. I would invite you to come up with an alternative business model for serving people who like…

> but I’m pretty comfortable pointing to existing cloud computing business models or streaming services as a precedent. Why are you this comfortable? Netflix, YouTube TV, Twitch, Sling, Amazon Prime Video -- basically all streaming services offer flat rates, not per-MB ones. Further, all existing game library services tout unlimited gaming as a primary selling point! That's the primary reason you opt into Gamefly or…

The amount of variable cost to stream music or video to a user is significantly less than the the variable cost to render high end graphics. The high end hardware costs money and depreciates. Why would it cost less to rent a gpu hour for generic purposes than it would to rent a gpu hour to play video games?

Re: Google unveils Stadia cloud gaming service

#292

Post by ocdtrekkie »

kabdib wrote: post #278
ocdtrekkie wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have they even said anything about the business model? I'm a few minutes behind on the stream, but I don't recall any mention of licenses or subscriptions. The only "practical" example of launching they game they showed was... out of a button on a YouTube video. EDIT: A "Stadia store" was briefly mentioned shortly after my comment, it looked like it was tied into Google Play.

They didn't say anything concrete about money. I'm guessing developers will be compensated with "exposure" :-)

The "Stadia store" suggested games would likely be sold or subscribed to. But I definitely have to imagine some sort of trial model being available for the launch-from-YouTube options. Perhaps a time-limited option, that won't stop you from joining a streamer with Crowd Play, but would cut you off after a while if you hadn't already purchased it?

I'm very curious about the expenses game developers will face too, which definitely wasn't brought up. Id Software bragged about just using one Stadia instance, but then later demonstrations showing split screen gaming "without compromise" was shown running each screen on a different Stadia instance. While Google suggests this makes split screen gaming possible again, my guess is that split screen gaming costs the developers twice as much to implement as a service cost, since it uses twice as much hardware. Making it probably mostly a nonstarter anyways.

Re: Google unveils Stadia cloud gaming service

#294

Post by jhall1468 »

_bxg1 wrote: post #227
jhall1468 wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They lack the ability to commit to a space and cultivate it That's because states, entrenched providers and in some cases local governments made every inch of work cost a mile of time. The cost was making Fiber a non-starter... ISP's benefited from nationwide networks largely funded by governments, then used their monopoly influence to prevent any competition, and "hired" state governments to enforce their monopoli…

I don't deny that ISP's make it far harder than it needs to be. They make it impossible for small upstarts. But Google, of all companies, had plenty of resources to make it happen if they really wanted to.

Blowing millions of dollars on an investment that will take decades to pay off isn't good business. Google decided, rightfully, that the answer was webpass. It's a better revenue generator, and has considerably lower barrier to entry.

Re: Google unveils Stadia cloud gaming service

#295

Post by dragontamer »

molecules wrote: post #288
dragontamer wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for explaining your experience! There's a lot of us out here who are curious how this thing works and the design tradeoffs.

I also was a participant. It was pretty cool. I did a wireshark and they are using Google's QUIC protocol. In my experience the game would drop graphics before I would experience input lag. There were a handful of times that I did experience input lag. This was on a wired connection 100mbs down 20mbs up through Xfinity. I did notice in the Google demo, that when the person was using the game pad, he experienced input…

Hmm, I think I like those design choices. A dropped frame or two isn't a big deal in my experience, while a delayed input is a far bigger detriment to the gaming experience. QUIC (and UDP in general) seems about right for the technology backend.

I'm still of the opinion that Google shot themselves in the foot here by having a bunch of wireless controllers in one room. Its like they've never talked to a Super Smash Bros Brawl tournament organizer before: Wii Nunchuks over 2.4GHz Bluetooth have dropped packets / dropped input issues when you get to ~20+ participants.

Don't do mass wireless in one room. It always ends poorly. I'd expect that local wireless in a typical living-room setting would be a better experience actually. After all: the major issue is whether or not the wired-connection / fiber backbone of the typical city is up to spec for this kind of thing. (A typical living room user probably doesn't have to worry about clogged 2.4GHz connections unless they're in an apartment I guess...)

Re: Google unveils Stadia cloud gaming service

#296

Post by botto »

ergo14 wrote: post #257
zarriak wrote: post #229

I really don't understand why people here aren't talking about the real underlying principle of this service. Google has captured the education and cheap laptop space with chromebooks. This is the logical extension of that software. Sure they will eventually combine chromeos and android but this is one more step in the direction of everything happening inside of your web browser. The entire reason this is happening i…

Unless I'm mistaken ChromeOS is only used in US schools on a wide scale.

There is a wide deployment in Norway I believe, but indeed, I've not heard of big deployments elsewhere.

Re: Google unveils Stadia cloud gaming service

#298

Post by orbifold »

danso wrote: post #126
Thaxll wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Problem is Google will never have high quality content from big publisher, it directly compete with their revenue so I'm not sure how they're going to get game on this platform.

Ubisoft's revenues are ~$2B. Google's is $130B+. Google already pays Apple $10B+ annually just to be the default search engine on iOS/macOS. You really think there's no room for negotiation here?

Close to 10% of their revenue? That is insane...

Re: Google unveils Stadia cloud gaming service

#300

Post by hiccuphippo »

holoduke wrote: post #234
minimaxir wrote: post #173

Other comments have suggested this might fail like OnLive/Nvidia/PlayStation Now because the economics of streaming on the business end don't work out. This case is different. Stadia is the first video game streaming product made by a cloud computing company, and also a cloud computing company which developed a video codec (VP9) just for high quality/low latency streaming. The economics are much different on all side…

It will fail because developers will think twice before willing to depend on another evil ecosystem from Google.

Developers will put their games where the users are. Right now most developers deploy to PC, XBox and PlayStation (and some to Switch) what's the cost of one more platform to deploy to vs the extra sales it can produce?
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