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Ubuntu will switch from X window server to Mir

wiki.ubuntu.com

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Re: Ubuntu will switch from X window server to Mir

#281

Post by lsiebert »

Either it will be better, worse, or a mixed bag.

If it's better, Then they have improved the ecosystem, and the developers and users will follow. If it's worse, then we can hope they will switch back, or they will lose users/developers.

The concern is a mixed bag... splitting development on something that may or may not ultimately win.

But mixed bags lead to innovation more than having one true way. Ideas from Mir and Wayland and X can lead to all three of them improving more then if only one or two of them were viable. However the lack of focus may slow individual development.

TL/DR Worst case is still not horrible, so long as Canonical recognizes it.

Re: Ubuntu will switch from X window server to Mir

#282

Post by rz2k »

keithpeter wrote: post #168
rdtsc wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In terms of user interface have those standards delivered? I remember fonts being really screwed up for a long time. Longer that it should have been. Just getting anti-aliased fonts was major deal. Then graphics drivers are a mess. I blame manufacturers of devices here. But still treating it as a black box I just see that is inferior. I know Linus flipped of NVidia but at the same time is a chicken and egg problem. W…

Yes. I shall follow with interest and run Ubuntu if my hardware allows. CentOS and Debian are there as lifeboats if needed. Choice is good!

Is Mint with Debian finally taking off?

That has the potential to be a really easy choice for desktop users, but a couple years ago it wasn't very smooth at all.

Re: Ubuntu will switch from X window server to Mir

#283

Post by sandGorgon »

This is Ubuntu's "Bada" move - it is scared of being assimilated by Android that it is forgetting that it can truly innovate in the UX and not by building walled gardens around display managers.

Ubuntu already has significant investment in Surfaceflinger/Android via its Touch vertical. It has also started migrating to QT/QML for its shell (which work really well on Android). There is a significant opportunity to innovate on UX (like Blackberry Z10), rather than throw away the ecosystem that would come with adopting an Android core.

Yesterday, I couldnt join a GoToMeeting using Ubuntu. But just after, I did it in less than 2 minutes by using an app oumy Android device. That is a huge ecosystem, that I want to use on my desktop (I dont know how the desktop UX for a touch app will work, but I hope it will).

I say that Ubuntu, Google and Valve should sit together and come up with a graphics+sound backend that will work together. And let me play Half Life 3 on my phone and desktop simultaneously !

Re: Ubuntu will switch from X window server to Mir

#284

Post by javert »

VLM wrote: post #222
hazov wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Simply don't use it...

Embrace extend extinguish. Wait until the only way to run FF / Chrome / 3-d accelerated video driver / vi / emacs / something else thats "critical" is to switch to Mir. After all its free, all you have to do is abandon everything else. What could go wrong? Simply don't use it is like telling people to take up a new hobby once theirs has been destroyed. But I don't want to take up a new hobby and I like this one. Sorr…

Hey VLM, could you take a look at this [1]? I wanted to get your advice on something, but it got buried. Thanks!

[1] http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5289406

Re: Ubuntu will switch from X window server to Mir

#285

Post by vor_ »

HerraBRE wrote: post #197
hmo09 wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple already have more developers contributing to useful upstream code than Canonical (Webkit, cups, LLVM).

Placating the tech crowd by giving away fragments of low level code is really just marketing and a way to retain talent that would otherwise refuse to work for them. It's not as if their users can actually use any of that stuff to change how their macs work (without switching to a different OS or browser).

You'd be complaining if they contributing nothing. Damned if they do, damned if they don't.

Re: Ubuntu will switch from X window server to Mir

#286

Post by vor_ »

tedks wrote: post #252
hmo09 wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple already have more developers contributing to useful upstream code than Canonical (Webkit, cups, LLVM).

Didn't Apple buy CUPS specifically so that they could keep parts of it proprietary? They're definitely only funneling money into LLVM so they can drop their dependencies on GCC, which will probably have a net harmful effect on the free software culture.

> which will probably have a net harmful effect on the free software culture.

Mind explaining how funding the development of free software hurts free software?

Re: Ubuntu will switch from X window server to Mir

#287

Post by dscrd »

raverbashing wrote: post #54
jlgreco wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Am I the only person in the world who has never had anything but a pleasant experience with PulseAudio? The first time I noticed that I was using it, I had already been using it for a year...

Let me ask you some questions then: - How often do you reboot your computer - What audio softwares you use the most For me, PA crashes around once a week (and this is with the latest version I tried), or just plain stops working (like muting the sound, garbled sound, etc) Not to mention the delay that happens while switching songs in mplayer for example. Use ALSA and song switch is instantaneous.

"Not to mention the delay that happens while switching songs in mplayer for example. Use ALSA and song switch is instantaneous. "

There's a good possibility that this is mplayer's fault more than PA's.

Re: Ubuntu will switch from X window server to Mir

#288

Post by hdevalence »

Retric wrote: post #277
gillianseed wrote: post #272

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes but then it's also being developed by far more companies than Apple. For 2012 Google submitted roughly twice as much code to Webkit as Apple (which came second), apart from them we have smaller yet notable contributors like RIM and Nokia (7% and 5% respectively).

Let's not forget that reduced maintenance costs are often touted as a reason to opensource code in the first place. And when you consider it was developed by Apple and so presumably fit there needs well when released it as working code, it's not surprising that adapting it to new use cases involves more work than maintaining it.

It was developed by the KDE project as KHTML. The reason that it's open-source is that it was Apple's fork of an existing free software project.

Re: Ubuntu will switch from X window server to Mir

#289

Post by asveikau »

elteto wrote: post #142

Wow. The sheer level of FUD and negativity that you can find on these comments is just mind blowing. It seems that most of it (with a few knowledgeable exceptions) is coming from folks who don't know what they are talking about and have never probably developed graphical applications for Linux. They can't elaborate a single technical reason as to why they dislike whatever it is they dislike, yet they still jump on th…

Your description sounds a lot like the bashing of X itself.

As someone who is happy with an X desktop I don't entirely get it. I understand that some of the folks doing Wayland have experience hacking on X but it seems a lot like wheel reinvention. X may have some warts but it's hard to argue that it's totally broken; it's also come a long way in the last 10 years or so, I'd say in testament to its ability to be extended. I think innovation in the toolkits (to catch up with where X is today) sounds like a better deal.

Re: Ubuntu will switch from X window server to Mir

#290

Post by raverbashing »

iso-8859-1 wrote: post #148
mercurial wrote: post #133

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Parent seems to have been experimenting this issue recently. Saying "PulseAudio got fixed" does not mean "it works perfectly for everybody" (see https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=813407 ). Most people will care more about getting a sound system which works without crashing and not sucking up CPU before getting sound system with streaming. The fact that you and me have had a good experience with it does not…

That's a Fedora bug. It wouldn't be bleeding-edge (enough!) if it didn't crash. Running Fedora and complaining in a public forum about crashes (without saying the distribution name in the first place!) makes no sense to me.

"without saying the distribution name in the first place"

RHEL 6, Fedora 16, Mint 11 (while it was not obsolete), Ubuntu Maverick Meercat (amongst others)

Oh ok, so Fedora users just have to suck it up and having a crashing system? Congratulations, you don't know anything about distros.

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