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I am worried about Bun

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Re: I am worried about Bun

#281

I disagree with the overall premise: Before the acquisition, Bun had to figure out how to monetize at some point. Now, even though their parent company does some shitty practices with their other software (claude code), it's a stretch to assume this will also translate into making Bun worse: Being worried makes sense but I remain optimistic about Bun. Especially given the context of both of these different context: C…

I disagree with the overall premise: Before the acquisition, GitHub had to figure out how to monetize at some point. Now, even though their parent company does some shitty practices with their other software (Embrace, Extend, Extinguish, MS Windows), it's a stretch to assume this will also translate into making GitHub worse: Being worried makes sense but I remain optimistic about GitHub.

1 9 of uptime later

Re: I am worried about Bun

#282
post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The audio and 3D card pioneers in the PC world. The ones that were first to market went all bankrupt, or were acquired by others that came later into the scene.

1. At least 99% of all species that ever lived on Earth are now extinct. I.e., that's life. 2. "But for a beautiful moment in time we created a lot of value for shareholders."

Failure for those species though.

Re: I am worried about Bun

#283

I disagree with the overall premise: Before the acquisition, Bun had to figure out how to monetize at some point. Now, even though their parent company does some shitty practices with their other software (claude code), it's a stretch to assume this will also translate into making Bun worse: Being worried makes sense but I remain optimistic about Bun. Especially given the context of both of these different context: C…

This is a good take, and I hope you're right. One favorable way to phrase it for Anthropic is they acquired Bun because CC and other internal tooling depended on it so heavily and they questioned it's future as purely OSS. It remains to be seen how things will actually unfold.

you can own your upstream supply chain while simultaneously being less responsive to user pain points

Re: I am worried about Bun

#284
post #73
post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> and it has started supporting TypeScript out of the box Node only does type stripping though. If you want proper TS support you still need a compiler. > I don’t think Bun will have many advantages after Node 26 There are tons of advantages. For instance, Bun includes a lot of features that would need a third party dependency in Node: db driver, S3 client, watch mode, bundler, JSX support, etc.

Why would you want DB drivers and S3 clients in your runtime? That’s exactly what 3rd parties are for, you don’t want to have to update your runtime for a new version of your drivers

Every approach has its pros and cons. OTOH the less you rely on third party deps, the less attack surface.

Re: I am worried about Bun

#285

Why people use Deno and Bun over Node? I think it's neat that there are competitors for JS runtimes, but I really don't understand what advantages I'd get by swapping to one of these over Node. Bun has no REPL and worse JS engine, Deno is just Node with a restrictive, annoying permission system and no sqlite. Both claim better performance, but that only seems true in cherrypicked benchmarks, and in my tests (granted…

> Deno is just Node with a restrictive, annoying permission system

I find Deno's permission system amazing! (although I didn't stick with it until v2)

Everything is closed by default but you're able to write code like normal.

Whenever it needs a permission the code pauses (like `debugger;`) and the terminal asks you "hey, should this script have access to this file/folder"?

- You say yes and the code continues (no need for exceptions).

- You say no and the code stops.

Then after your program has run, you put only the answers you said yes to in a deno.json file and it never has to ask again.

---------------------------------------

I'm currently working on a project that takes in heap of files from one one set of devs, processes them with a heap of files from another set of devs, then compiles and outputs the final product.

The file structure goes like this:

1. Group one devs

2. Group two devs

3. Build output

4. Compiler

So group one only works in their folder, and group two only works in their folder, but needs to see group one's folder.

With Deno it's stupidly easy to do stuff like:

- Scripts in group one only have file read access to group one.

- Scripts in group two only have file read access to group one and two.

- Scripts in the compiler only have file read access to group one and two's folders, only have file write access to build-output folder, and can read the env file in the project's root directory.

- One specific file is only allowed to access a specific URL and port

- Another specific file is only allowed to use the FFI to access a specific shared object.

I don't need to worry about a dev's script accidentally using the wrong file because they messed up the path.

I don't need to worry about a dev accidentally overwriting a file and losing data.

I don't need to worry about a dev blindly going down the wrong road because an LLM convinced them to.

I don't need to worry about a dev using LLMs agents that are trying to make the project do something it's not supposed to do.

I don't need to worry about a dev including a dependency that's doing what it shouldn't be doing.

I don't need to worry about the equivalent of `rm -rf ./$BUILD-OUTPUT` but the env file wasn't set up correctly and $BUILD-OUTPUT is empty/undefined evaluating to `rm -rf ./` and nuking the project's root.

I don't need to worry about supply-chain attacks.

I don't need to worry about namesquatting attacks.

There's so many things I don't need to worry about.

It's such a breath of fresh air.

It's just: you guys read from here, other guys read from here, the compiler writes to here.

Whenever something doesn't fit, the program stops and tells you what file is trying to access what permission.

---------------------------------------

aside: Node added a permission system but it's completely broken by design. Everything's open and you have to manually close each permission yourself. Oh, you don't want this project to have file write permissions? Lets just turn off the file write permissions (and forget to also turn off the subprocess permissions to spawn a shell which rm -rf's the wrong folder).

Re: I am worried about Bun

#286

Why people use Deno and Bun over Node? I think it's neat that there are competitors for JS runtimes, but I really don't understand what advantages I'd get by swapping to one of these over Node. Bun has no REPL and worse JS engine, Deno is just Node with a restrictive, annoying permission system and no sqlite. Both claim better performance, but that only seems true in cherrypicked benchmarks, and in my tests (granted…

> Both claim better performance, but that only seems true in cherrypicked benchmarks, and in my tests (granted about a year ago at this point) both alternatives under-performed Node in my workloads.

1) You need to retest again, mainly because Bun's own native tools should be faster than Node's.

2) My experience is the opposite: For the niche uses I'm on, the rendering process is done 2-3x faster with only a few changes to use Bun's tools.

Re: I am worried about Bun

#287

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a big leap to go from "some users may be using large quantities of tokens" to "the labs are burning money on subs in an attempt to kill the competition." Lots of businesses have subscription programs in which a small number of users are money losers, but which in aggregate make money. It's not even obvious that the labs are losing a lot of money on even a minority of users; the rate use caps are fairly aggressiv…

I work in the video AI world. We gave up on subscriptions long ago. They're rinky dink and get you a paltry amount of utilization before they run out. The per day per seat costs can exceed $1000. This is already normal for studios, and it's already producing positive ROI. There's simply no way to price video any other way than by usage. I suspect the same will come for everything.

positive ROI for customers?

Re: I am worried about Bun

#288
post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is also assuming that AGI is even possible. So far there is no evidence that this is actually doable over anything but billions of years (and even then we have no idea how nature really managed it). Edit: Meant to say AGI (superintelligence didn't make sense). Superintelligence is undefinable at the moment so even considering if it's possible or not is more of a philosophical thing/si-fi thought experiment than…

ASI is the acronym you’re looking for. It stands for Artificial Superintelligence. Arguably it’s already here. ChatGPT knows more than any human who has ever lived. It can carry out millions of conversations at once. And it has better working memory (“context”) than humans. And it can speak and write code much faster than humans. Humans still have some advantages: Specialists are smarter than chatgpt in most domains.…

We have more like Artificial Superstupidity.

Ultimately our current model is extremely unlikely to perform better than the sum of current human knowledge. Godlike super-intelligence is a pipe dream with the current LLM based approaches.

Re: I am worried about Bun

#289
post #273
post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you use Gentoo as OS?

I did for over a decade, but it does not go far enough with supply chain security. I bootstrapped a new generation of Linux distribution from 180 bytes of human readable x86 machine code all the way up. https://stagex.tools

You should probably caveat any post you make about security concerns with that, so people can more easily judge whether your concerns line up with their threat model.

Re: I am worried about Bun

#290
post #188

"I want a serious Node.js alternative." Then you could have been using Deno, like many of us, for years.

Wild example as it has been corrupted by VC money as well. I wouldn’t touch deno either.

What do you mean by corrupted?

Been using Deno happily for many years now.

Did I miss anything?

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