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AWS to bare metal two years later: Answering your questions about leaving AWS

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Re: AWS to bare metal two years later: Answering your questions about leaving AWS

#281

Post by nik736 »

hedora wrote: post #254
nik736 wrote: post #9

It's an interesting article, thanks for that. What people forget about the OVH or Hetzner comparison is that for those entry servers they are known for, think the Advance line with OVH or AX with Hetzner. Those boxes come with some drawbacks. The OVH Advance line for example comes without ECC memory, in a server, that might host databases. It's a disaster waiting to happen. There is no option to add ECC memory with t…

Their current advance offerings use AMD EPYC 4004 with on-die ECC. I can’t figure out if it’s “real” single correction double detection, or if the data lines between the processor and dimms are protected or not though.

It's only on-die ECC not real ECC

Re: AWS to bare metal two years later: Answering your questions about leaving AWS

#282

Post by the_duke »

antonkochubey wrote: post #46
rco8786 wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anytime I have to go into the AWS control panel (which is often) I am immediately overwhelmed with a sense of dread. It's just the most bloated overcomplicated thing I could possibly imagine.

You're lucky not to have dealt with Azure and GCP control panels, in that case :-)

GCP is pretty good though, considering the complexity.

Azure is ... a different story...

Re: AWS to bare metal two years later: Answering your questions about leaving AWS

#283

Post by indymike »

esskay wrote: post #54
bilekas wrote: post #11

I'm so surprised there is so much pushback against this.. AWS is extremely expensive. The use cases for setting up your system or service entirely in AWS are more rare than people seem to realise. Maybe I'm just the old man screaming at cloud (no pun intended) but when did people forget how to run a baremetal server ? > We have 730+ days with 99.993% measured availability and we also escaped AWS region wide downtime…

> I'm so surprised there is so much pushback against this I'm not. It seems to be happening a lot. Any time a topic about not using AWS comes up here, or on Reddit there a sudden surge of people appearing out of nowhere shouting down anyone who suggests other options. It's honestly starting to feel like paid shilling.

A lot of people here's careers have been made by moving into AWS. A lot of people's future careers will be made by moving out of AWS. That's just the tech treadmill in action.

Do what works best for your situation.

Re: AWS to bare metal two years later: Answering your questions about leaving AWS

#284

Post by vidarh »

embedding-shape wrote: post #193
hibikir wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, they aren't wrong about the bare metal either: Every organization ends up tied to their staff, and said staff was hired to work on the stack you are using. People end up in quite the fights because their supposed experts are more fond of uniformity and learning nothing new. Many a company was stuck with a datacenter unit that was unresponsive to the company's needs, and people migrated to AWS to avoid dealing w…

> said staff was hired to work on the stack you are using Looking back at doing various hiring decisions at various levels of organizations, this is probably the single biggest mistake I've done multiple times, hiring specific people using specific technology because we were specifically using that. You'll end up with a team unwilling to change, because "you hired me for this, even if it's best for the business with…

Exactly. If someone has "Cloud Engineer" in the headline of their resume instead of "Devops Engineer" it's already warning and worth probing. If someone has "AWS|VMWare Engineer" in their bio, it's a giant red flag to me. Sometimes it's people just being aware where they'll find demand, but often it's indicative of someone who will push their pet stack - and it doesn't matter if it's VMWare on-prem or AWS (both purely as examples; it doesn't matter which specific tech it is), it's equally bad if they identify with a specific stack irrespective of what the stack is.

I'll also tend to look closely at whether people have "gotten stuck" specialising in a single stack. It won't make me turn them down, but it will make me ask extra questions to determine how open they are to alternatives when suitable.

Re: AWS to bare metal two years later: Answering your questions about leaving AWS

#286

Post by [deleted] »

lossolo wrote: post #130
nik736 wrote: post #9

It's an interesting article, thanks for that. What people forget about the OVH or Hetzner comparison is that for those entry servers they are known for, think the Advance line with OVH or AX with Hetzner. Those boxes come with some drawbacks. The OVH Advance line for example comes without ECC memory, in a server, that might host databases. It's a disaster waiting to happen. There is no option to add ECC memory with t…

These concerns are exaggerated. I've been running on Hetzner, OVH and friends for 20 years. During that time I've had only two issues, one about 15 years ago when a PSU failed on one of the servers, and another a few years ago when an OVH data center caught fire and one of the servers went down. There have been no other hardware issues. YMMV.

[deleted]

Re: AWS to bare metal two years later: Answering your questions about leaving AWS

#287

Post by amluto »

embedding-shape wrote: post #22
seidleroni wrote: post #14

As someone who works with firmware, it is funny how different our definitions of "bare metal" is.

As someone who does material science, it's funny how our definition of "bare metal" is so different.

Ask an astronomer what a “metal” is.

Re: AWS to bare metal two years later: Answering your questions about leaving AWS

#288

Post by amluto »

aeve890 wrote: post #90

>We're now moving to Talos. We PXE boot with Tinkerbell, image with Talos, manage configs through Flux and Terraform, and run conformance suites before each Kubernetes upgrade. Gee, how hard is to find SE experts in that particular combination of available ops tools? While in AWS every AWS certified engineer would speak the same language, the DIY approach surely suffers from the lack of "one way" to do things. Change…

I would not want to hire an engineer who claimed to be proficient with any cloud Kubernetes stack but couldn’t learn Talos in a week.

Re: AWS to bare metal two years later: Answering your questions about leaving AWS

#289

Post by maccard »

wredcoll wrote: post #186
maccard wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I work for a small company owned by a huge company. We are entirely independent except for purchasing, IT, and budget approval. We run our CI on AWS, and it’s slow and flaky for a variety of reasons (compiling large c++ projects combined with instance type pressure). It’s also expensive. We planned a migration to move from 4OD instances to one on prem machine and we guessed we’d save $1000/mo, our builds would be fas…

This is the root success of aws, it lets internal teams bypass sysadmin departments.

The same story applies for software. If I want to buy a license of X for someone, I have to go through procurement, and it takes weeks even for <$50 purchases. Yet if its on the AWS marketplace it’s pre approved as long is doesn’t breach the AWS budget.

Re: AWS to bare metal two years later: Answering your questions about leaving AWS

#290

Post by sneak »

esskay wrote: post #54
bilekas wrote: post #11

I'm so surprised there is so much pushback against this.. AWS is extremely expensive. The use cases for setting up your system or service entirely in AWS are more rare than people seem to realise. Maybe I'm just the old man screaming at cloud (no pun intended) but when did people forget how to run a baremetal server ? > We have 730+ days with 99.993% measured availability and we also escaped AWS region wide downtime…

> I'm so surprised there is so much pushback against this I'm not. It seems to be happening a lot. Any time a topic about not using AWS comes up here, or on Reddit there a sudden surge of people appearing out of nowhere shouting down anyone who suggests other options. It's honestly starting to feel like paid shilling.

If your spend is less than a few thousand per month, using cloud services is a no-brainer. For most startups starting up, their spend is minimal, so launching on the cloud is the default (and correct!) option.

Migrating to lower cost options thereafter when scaling is prudent, but you "build one to throw away", as it were.

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