Hyatt Hotels are using algorithmic Rest “smoking detectors” • Hacker News Board

Re: Hyatt Hotels are using algorithmic Rest “smoking detectors”

#281

Post by vkou » Sat, Jul 19, 2025, 6:01 PM UTC

egypturnash wrote: post #160

lxgr wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Their "NoiseAware" main product line also sounds incredibly dystopian. Apparently, that's a "privacy-safe" microphone listening in rental properties, to "detect crowds gathering"...!? This type of creepy stuff, together with Airbnb's horrible business practices (last time they wanted access to my checking account transaction history via Plaid!) and enabling scammy hosts, is why I'm back to just staying at regular hot…

AirBnB partiers are a real problem, I live in a tourist destination and regularly hear horror stories about a residential neighborhood suddenly having crowds descend on a house that's become a party rental. There's nobody to notice it getting out of hand and tell them to chill before the neighbors call the cops because the owner is a holding company on the other side of the country. Of course Airbnbs are also a real…

> AirBnB partiers are a real problem,

They are, which is why residential properties that are used as hotels should be seized and auctioned off.

Re: Hyatt Hotels are using algorithmic Rest “smoking detectors”

#282

Post by margalabargala » Sat, Jul 19, 2025, 6:01 PM UTC

mindslight wrote: post #186

abtinf wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seems like a candidate for class action lawsuits against the hotel, the brand, and the sensor company?

Class action lawsuits are a boon for corpos. They take what should be many separate instances of fraud with unknown unknowns and tie them all off in one small garbage bag. Half the money goes to the attorneys and the other half is a token payment or even just funds a coupon to encourage doing more business with the perpetrator. I'd really like to see some service that facilitates you opting out of a class action, and…

They're a boom compared the the impossible ideal world where every instance is prosecuted separately, but barring the superhuman feat of getting thousands of individuals to show up to court, they are certainly far worse for corporations than any realistic alternate scenario.

Re: Hyatt Hotels are using algorithmic Rest “smoking detectors”

#283

Post by jplrssn » Sat, Jul 19, 2025, 6:02 PM UTC

dwroberts wrote: post #260

jplrssn wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They absolutely prey on people not being having the time/resources to fight back. A friend in the UK had his deposit withheld as "mail charges" by his landlord upon moving out. Turned out the fine print in his lease said that he wasn't allowed to receive mail at the house he was legally renting.

> his lease said that he wasn't allowed to receive mail at the house he was legally renting. Pretty sure that is not a stipulation you can legally put in a tenancy contract. Because both parties have to be able to serve notice on the other via post in writing. Same reason you are legally entitled to know the postal address of the landlord.

I'm sure you are right, but that didn't stop the landlord from trying their luck. Your observation about serving notice is on point, because in the end the deposit was returned only after my friend filed a small claims case against them.

Re: Hyatt Hotels are using algorithmic Rest “smoking detectors”

#284

Post by CamperBob2 » Sat, Jul 19, 2025, 6:03 PM UTC

EliRivers wrote: post #273

CamperBob2 wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've never understood this old saw. The computer is just a tool. Somebody owns the computer, somebody installed it, somebody loaded software onto it. That's who should be held accountable. Taken at face value, you couldn't even use a pocket calculator to back up a management decision.

"Taken at face value, you couldn't even use a pocket calculator to back up a management decision." That makes no sense. I am the manager. I make the decision. The calculator gives me some numbers but I am still the manager, still the decision maker, and I can use any tools appropriate to inform my decisions. Even a calculator. Taken at face value, that's what it says. That the calculator doesn't make the management d…

That's exactly what I'm saying. So what earthly point is there in saying, "A computer can't make management decisions, because it can't take responsibility?"

It's a content-free sentence. There is nothing special about a computer in that regard. It's a tool... a tool wielded by a human somewhere. Anyone who tries to blame "the computer" should not be allowed to do so, and it's weird that it ever occurred to anyone to try that.

Re: Hyatt Hotels are using algorithmic Rest “smoking detectors”

#285

Post by idiotsecant » Sat, Jul 19, 2025, 6:03 PM UTC

vkou wrote: post #278

nine_zeros wrote: post #265

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Oh, that's a common misunderstanding, but they can't sue me in court – by accepting me as a customer, they accepted my binding arbitration agreement! It clearly said so on my luggage tag their authorized agent (i.e. the bellboy) handled as part of check-in. Why can't there be a human membership union that sets these automatic binding arbitration agreements on service providers on behalf of members? Is there any law…

> Why can't there be a human membership union that sets these automatic binding arbitration agreements on service providers on behalf of members? Those already exist, we call those things 'governments'.

I think we got some wires crossed somewhere, my government is helping them beat me up more ...

Re: Hyatt Hotels are using algorithmic Rest “smoking detectors”

#286

Post by vkou » Sat, Jul 19, 2025, 6:03 PM UTC

gpm wrote: post #108

vkou wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A number like 84x implies that it's almost entirely false positives.

No... it could be false positives, it could also be that almost no one (~1%) of smokers were caught before and this is actually a miracle technology that detects smoking. Frankly it tracks that almost no one was caught before.

The hotels don't ever catch people in the act, they just let housekeeping report that the room smells like smoke and they take the fine out of your deposit.

That's why they demand a deposit (or a card), by the way.

Re: Hyatt Hotels are using algorithmic Rest “smoking detectors”

#287

Post by jplrssn » Sat, Jul 19, 2025, 6:05 PM UTC

hdgvhicv wrote: post #236

jplrssn wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They absolutely prey on people not being having the time/resources to fight back. A friend in the UK had his deposit withheld as "mail charges" by his landlord upon moving out. Turned out the fine print in his lease said that he wasn't allowed to receive mail at the house he was legally renting.

I have no idea what “mail” is, but I’d love to see the result of the outcome when they issues a challenge at the deposit protection company.

> I have no idea what “mail” is

Not a native speaker. How do you refer to the pieces of paper that the Royal Mail sometimes drop through your letterbox?

Re: Hyatt Hotels are using algorithmic Rest “smoking detectors”

#288

Post by bloomingeek » Sat, Jul 19, 2025, 6:06 PM UTC

Outrageous! We always stay, if we don't pull our travel trailer, in $100 a night hotels when on the road in the states. They will take cash for the room, but require a debit or credit card in case there's damage or fridge items usage. Neither of us smoke and always ask for a non-smoking room. To think this could happen is other worldly.

Re: Hyatt Hotels are using algorithmic Rest “smoking detectors”

#289

Post by vkou » Sat, Jul 19, 2025, 6:08 PM UTC

idiotsecant wrote: post #285

vkou wrote: post #278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Why can't there be a human membership union that sets these automatic binding arbitration agreements on service providers on behalf of members? Those already exist, we call those things 'governments'.

I think we got some wires crossed somewhere, my government is helping them beat me up more ...

It takes constant vigilance to prevent that union from being captured by management.

Re: Hyatt Hotels are using algorithmic Rest “smoking detectors”

#290

Post by SoftTalker » Sat, Jul 19, 2025, 6:08 PM UTC

jmb99 wrote: post #220

grishka wrote: post #216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do hotels in the US not allow you to pay with cash any more? What if you don't have an internationally accepted card?

Generally speaking, no. Most major hotel chains require a credit card.

Credit card is a proxy for an acceptable credit score. It's a filter so they can exclude irresponsible people without exposing themselves to claims of discrimination or racism.

Unfortunately people who simply choose to live without using credit are caught up in that too.