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OpenAI says it has evidence DeepSeek used its model to train competitor

ft.com

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Re: OpenAI says it has evidence DeepSeek used its model to train competitor

#281
Is OpenAI claiming copyright ownership over the generated synthetic data?

That would be a dangerous precedent to establish.

If it's a terms of service violation, I guess they're within their rights to terminate service, but what other recourse do they have?

Other than that, perhaps this is just rhetoric aimed at introducing restrictions in the US, to prevent access to foreign AI, to establish a national monopoly?

Re: OpenAI says it has evidence DeepSeek used its model to train competitor

#282
post #21

This is absolutely hilarious! :) ClosedAI scraped human content without asking and they explained why this was acceptable... but when the outputs of their training corpus is scraped, it is THEIR dataset and this is NOT acceptable! Oh, the irony! :D I shared a few screenshots of DeepSeek answering using ChatGPT's output in yesterday's article! https://semking.com/deepseek-china-ai-model-breakthrough-sec...

[flagged]

Indeed. First thing I thought was "call a wahmbulance!".

Re: OpenAI says it has evidence DeepSeek used its model to train competitor

#283
Boo hoo. Competition isn't fun when I'm not winning. Typical Americans. When Americans are running around ruining the social cohesion of several developing nations, that's just fair competition, but as soon as they get even the smallest hint of real competition they run to demonize it.

Yes deepseek is going to steal all of your data. OpenAI would so the same. Yes the CCP is going to get access to your data and use it to decide if you get to visit or whatever. The white house does the same.

Re: OpenAI says it has evidence DeepSeek used its model to train competitor

#284
post #87

I'm not being sarcastic, but we may soon have to torrent DeepSeek's model. OpenAI has a lot of clout in the US and could get DeepSeek banned in western countries for copyright.

> US and could get DeepSeek banned in western countries for copyright

If US is going to proceed with trade war on EU, as it was planning anyway, then DeepSeek will be banned only in US. Seems like term "western countries" is slowly eroding.

Re: OpenAI says it has evidence DeepSeek used its model to train competitor

#285

It's reasonably likely that a lot of people linked to the federal government want to ban DeepSeek. You can tell it's being presented away from "they gave us a free set of weights" and towards "they destroyed $1T of shareholder value." (By revealing that Microsoft et al. paid way too much to OpenAI et al. for technology that was actually easy to reinvent.)

It was so easy it cost hundreds of millions of dollars, only one company has done it and they had to lie about it

Re: OpenAI says it has evidence DeepSeek used its model to train competitor

#286

The US government likely will favor a large strategic company like OpenAI instead of individual's copyrights, so while ironic, the US government definitely doesn't care. And the US government is also likely itching to reduce the power of Chinese AI companies that could out compete US rivals (similar to the treatment of BYD, TikTok, solar panel manufacturers, network equipment manufacturers, etc), so expect sweeping l…

I don’t think US government can move fast enough to change the trajectory. Also it doesn’t help that basically every government is second guessing their alliance with the US. It’s not an industry that can ruin local industries either (like cheap BYD is bad for German cars).

It’s a very fun thing to watch from the sidelines right now, if I’ll be honest.

Re: OpenAI says it has evidence DeepSeek used its model to train competitor

#287

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

I don’t care for Sam Altman and his general untrustworthy behavior. But DeepSeek is perhaps more untrustworthy. Models from American companies at least aren’t surprising us with government driven misinformation, and even though safety can also be censorship, the companies that make these models at least openly talk about their safety programs. DeepSeek is implementing a censorship and propaganda program without admit…

DeepSeek v3 (where the training cost claims come from) was announced a month ago and it had no impact outside of a small circle

Re: OpenAI says it has evidence DeepSeek used its model to train competitor

#289
post #103

This is funny because its. 1. Something I'd expect to happen. 2. Lived through a similar scenario in 2010 or so. Early in my professional career I've worked for a media company that was scraping other sites (think Craigslist but for our local market) to republish the content on our competing website. I wasn't working on that specific project, but I did work on an integration on my teams project where the scraping tea…

Nice one, thank you for sharing !

Re: OpenAI says it has evidence DeepSeek used its model to train competitor

#290
post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Realistically that's the actual headline. Only another AI can replace AI, pretty much like LLMs / Transformers have replaced "old" AI models in certain task (NLP, Sentiment Analysis, Translation etc) and research is in progress for other tasks as well performed by traditional models (personalization, forecasting, anomaly detection etc). If there's a better AI, old AI will lose the job first.

> NLP, Sentiment Analysis, Translation etc As somebody who got to work adjacent to some of these things for a long time, I've been wondering about this. Are LLMs and transformers actually better than these "old" models or is it more of an 80/20 thing where for a lot less work (on developers' behalf) LLMs can get 80% of the efficacy of these old models? I ask because I worked for a company that had a related content e…

Yep, it's an 80/20 thing. Versatility over quality.
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