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I believe California is the dumping ground for America's homeless problem

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Re: I believe California is the dumping ground for America's homeless problem

#281
post #278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would you mind elaborating on what you are afraid of happening, and what you think the cause is?

Blight and crime. And as I mentioned in the other fork, I grew up in Russia during the 90ies collapse, so my standards for lack of blight and crime are relatively low ;)

Do you live close to ballard or bitter lake then? That’s the only part of Seattle getting that bad from my understanding.

Re: I believe California is the dumping ground for America's homeless problem

#282
post #275

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Housing is cheap in much of the country though, and really cheap in some areas. Also, there are warm states that are not CA that don't have the problem (relatively speaking), and there are far colder states like NY or WA that do (ditto for locations within states). Why don't NY homeless move to e.g. Detroit? Far cheaper housing, comparable climate. The only people who wouldn't benefit from this under nationwide housi…

It tends to be cheap where there's no grocery stores, no jobs, etc. If you have to drive a long way for everything you need, it's not a cheap lifestyle, even if your rent is relatively low. Nationwide walkable housing would, in fact, fix it for some people, in part by bringing down the cost of housing and transit to a level they could reach.

Do you think that walkable housing is viable nationwide? Seems to me it would only be viable in urban areas, vast swathes of north America are very very remote, the people that live there by and large choose to. Wouldn't it make more sense to just build more grocery stores?

Re: I believe California is the dumping ground for America's homeless problem

#283
Sure. Why not. They (government and citizens who elect the government) are all stupid patsies who willing allow themselves to be abused in this way. They get what they deserve! If they had spines, they prevent it and/or reverse it. But they "think with emotions" so they are incapable of doing the right thing for the state and its citizens.

BTW NYC did the same thing during the 1970s/1980s to clean up homelessness and criminality of NYC: folks were bused to upstate cities of Albany, Rochester and Buffalo to "get them out of the problem space" of NYC. That was key to how NYC recovered from the 1970s hell-hole it has become. Now it's returning to the same and current leadership is again spineless.

Re: I believe California is the dumping ground for America's homeless problem

#284
post #264

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would you mind elaborating on what you are afraid of happening, and what you think the cause is?

Rampant property crime with no legal repercussions is common here. People shoot up in parks (and now on school property!) and the city is now denying permits for kids to use parks because of the camps. The problem is a learned helplessness of the electorate combined with reasonable voters leaving, resulting in people who want to double down on the status quo replacing them. There is zero political will to enforce vag…

It should be socially acceptable to live in a tent. There shouldn't be a big jump between renting a room and living in a tent. People who live in tents shouldn't be seen as some kind of underclass with the label "homeless". There should be a continuum with painless mobility between a tent, a room, an apartment, a house. Everyone should be expected to follow the law. The system should work for all people, all the way from 0 to infinity.

Re: I believe California is the dumping ground for America's homeless problem

#285
post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

there are many other high cost cities in the world and yet only american liberal ones are in a state of decay and allow homelessness and crime

Honest question: Are you claiming that "liberal" has something to do with it? If not, feel free to ignore the rest of this. If so, maybe you can elaborate on what you mean. Are there non-liberal high-cost cities in the US in a better state? Furthermore, it's worth noting that the other high-cost cities worldwide almost universally seem to have more left-leaning (or US liberal) policies on most issues than most high-c…

https://www.coalitionforthehomeless.org/wp-content/uploads/2...

Look at that graph and then ask yourself what changed in 2013. Hint, 1994-2001 they had a republican mayor. 2002-2013 they had a moderate republican who turned into a moderate democrat. And 2014 - now they've had a radical progressive.

Re: I believe California is the dumping ground for America's homeless problem

#286

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It tends to be cheap where there's no grocery stores, no jobs, etc. If you have to drive a long way for everything you need, it's not a cheap lifestyle, even if your rent is relatively low. Nationwide walkable housing would, in fact, fix it for some people, in part by bringing down the cost of housing and transit to a level they could reach.

Do you think that walkable housing is viable nationwide? Seems to me it would only be viable in urban areas, vast swathes of north America are very very remote, the people that live there by and large choose to. Wouldn't it make more sense to just build more grocery stores?

It's viable in a lot more areas than it exists in currently.

I'm not suggesting no one should ever live in a remote area. If that's what people want, cool.

When I say nationwide, I mean we need more housing that makes sense in all 50 states, not just California. I don't mean this should be the only kind of infrastructure we allow.

Re: I believe California is the dumping ground for America's homeless problem

#287

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Link local minimum wage to three times median rent for a 2 bedroom apartment, then. Solve both problems! :) (EDIT: assuming you have policy to maintain full employment…)

I've never understood why working the most entry level job should afford you a midrange 2br. Why not link minimum wage to 3x rent for an entry level apartment?

Because we learned in the 20th Century that intentionally concentrating lots of poor people in substandard housing leads to ghettoization and slums.

Re: I believe California is the dumping ground for America's homeless problem

#288
post #285

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honest question: Are you claiming that "liberal" has something to do with it? If not, feel free to ignore the rest of this. If so, maybe you can elaborate on what you mean. Are there non-liberal high-cost cities in the US in a better state? Furthermore, it's worth noting that the other high-cost cities worldwide almost universally seem to have more left-leaning (or US liberal) policies on most issues than most high-c…

https://www.coalitionforthehomeless.org/wp-content/uploads/2... Look at that graph and then ask yourself what changed in 2013. Hint, 1994-2001 they had a republican mayor. 2002-2013 they had a moderate republican who turned into a moderate democrat. And 2014 - now they've had a radical progressive.

This would make sense if "number of homeless people sleeping in a registered shelter" was in any way a useful statistic. Without a denominator, such as number of available shelter beds, and other data such as where are the shelters in relation to clusters of homeless people... it can tell a lot of different stories.

There are millions of variables that inform "the homeless problem" and isolating a pretty minor one -- political affiliation of a single politician in the nation's largest city, overseen by both state and federal governments -- just strikes me as really simplistic.

Re: I believe California is the dumping ground for America's homeless problem

#289
post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, and those 55% wield extremely disproportionate political power. This is why I’m pessimistic that NIMBYs will always rule.

> Yes, and those 55% wield extremely disproportionate political power. House owners don't have any additional political power than renters. Still one vote per person and politicians don't consult homeowners any more often than anyone else.

One Czech ex-minister of health owns 67 properties. So he probably has a lot of acquintances and relatives among the political elite of my country. To me it seems he has more political power than me, a dude sitting in underwear and ranting on Hackernews.

Re: I believe California is the dumping ground for America's homeless problem

#290
post #54

More of a magnet than a dumping ground, it’s not like the homeless were sent to California. Local incentives are more likely to blame.

> More of a magnet than a dumping ground, it’s not like the homeless were sent to California. Local incentives are more likely to blame.

Nevada used to give homeless mental patients bus tickets to California [0][1].

[0] http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2015/10/nevada-settles-b...

[1] http://www.sacbee.com/news/investigations/nevada-patient-bus...

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