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Google’s constant product shutdowns are damaging its brand

arstechnica.com

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Re: Google’s constant product shutdowns are damaging its brand

#281

Post by rifung »

bad_user wrote: post #224
Wowfunhappy wrote: post #210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You should be purchasing hardware based on whether the current model looks good, not what model may be next in that product line. The latter is pointless and largely impossible. Chrome OS itself isn't going anywhere.

How the product looks is a very superficial criterion. As developers we understand the value of the ecosystem and we want to invest in products that last longer that one or two years. Also I own Apple and Thinkpad laptops that are between 1 and 7 years old and all of them are still working fine. Laptops last longer than smartphones so you want to ensure the platform will be supported for the next 10 years. Can you ho…

> Can you honestly say that Google will support Chrome OS for the next 10 years? Personally I doubt it.

I work for Chrome OS, opinions are my own.

I think yes it will be supported because Google is trying very hard to diversify its revenue streams and Chrome OS actually makes money and is still growing quickly.

Note that Chrome OS is an entirely separate PA (product area) from Hardware.

Re: Google’s constant product shutdowns are damaging its brand

#282

Post by CobrastanJorji »

s0rce wrote: post #150
jamesgeck0 wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it's Google subsidized free existence killed the market for alternatives Did it? IIRC, there were at least six decent alternatives available when Reader closed. More if you count desktop and mobile applications.

I tested a few that appeared from the ashes. Ended up not liking most of them but eventually found bazqux and pay them money.

I switched to Feedly the day they announced the shutdown because it could import from Reader, looked like Reader, and used a lot of the same shortcuts. Is bazqux better?

Re: Google’s constant product shutdowns are damaging its brand

#283

Post by addicted »

Wowfunhappy wrote: post #125
s3r3nity wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I totally understand this - but it doesn't mean I like it. I could get through having two podcast apps on my Android (Google Podcasts, Google Play Music) that give me notifications for my podcasts, with no plans on phasing out one or the other. I could get over having two different music apps - Google Play Music and YouTube Music - because it seemed like there might actually be a plan here - albeit we haven't heard a…

> The FINAL straw was falling in love with a PixelBook that I bought during the Black Friday sales, as I moved into a role in an org that was 1) deeply invested in G Suite and 2) allowed me to do all my work from the browser - making the Chrome OS concept finally fit for me. THEN Google closes that part of their hardware division. The PixelBook isn't going to stop getting security updates any time soon, so if it was…

What if the machine gets lost or damaged?

You've invested in a platform that you now don't have the same kind of access to anymore.

Re: Google’s constant product shutdowns are damaging its brand

#284

Post by rifung »

s3r3nity wrote: post #113
jfasi wrote: post #61

Warning: Personal opinion ahead To understand why this keeps happening, you need to understand the product and engineering culture at Google. As a group, Google engineers and PMs are obsessed with promotion. At the heart of every conversation about system design or product proposal lies an unspoken (and sometimes spoken) question: will working on this get me promoted? The criteria for promotion at Google, especially…

I totally understand this - but it doesn't mean I like it. I could get through having two podcast apps on my Android (Google Podcasts, Google Play Music) that give me notifications for my podcasts, with no plans on phasing out one or the other. I could get over having two different music apps - Google Play Music and YouTube Music - because it seemed like there might actually be a plan here - albeit we haven't heard a…

> The FINAL straw was falling in love with a PixelBook that I bought during the Black Friday sales, as I moved into a role in an org that was 1) deeply invested in G Suite and 2) allowed me to do all my work from the browser - making the Chrome OS concept finally fit for me. THEN Google closes that part of their hardware division.

FWIW Chrome OS is a separate PA (product area) than Hardware so Hardware closing whatever division likely has very little impact on the support for your Pixelbook.

I am also sad about that though as I really like the Pixelbook =[

Re: Google’s constant product shutdowns are damaging its brand

#286

Post by Wowfunhappy »

bad_user wrote: post #224
Wowfunhappy wrote: post #210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You should be purchasing hardware based on whether the current model looks good, not what model may be next in that product line. The latter is pointless and largely impossible. Chrome OS itself isn't going anywhere.

How the product looks is a very superficial criterion. As developers we understand the value of the ecosystem and we want to invest in products that last longer that one or two years. Also I own Apple and Thinkpad laptops that are between 1 and 7 years old and all of them are still working fine. Laptops last longer than smartphones so you want to ensure the platform will be supported for the next 10 years. Can you ho…

I think there's a super important distinction here between hardware and platforms/software. The GP was annoyed that they bought a PixelBook before Google killed their hardware division. If I bought a Dell XPS laptop to run Windows, and Dell announced the next day they were discontinuing their XPS line, I wouldn't regret my purchase. Dell's decision doesn't change either the utility of my current hardware or the overall Windows ecosystem.

Regardless of whether or not Chrome OS is here to stay—I very much think it is, personally—Google closing their hardware division doesn't tell us much about Chrome OS's future. Only a tiny fraction of Chrome OS hardware comes from Google itself.

Re: Google’s constant product shutdowns are damaging its brand

#287

Post by stcredzero »

dageshi wrote: post #275
stcredzero wrote: post #265

Earlier quoted context omitted.

GMail, YouTube, Search, GCP, Android, and others...deep down they’re frontends for search or advertising... Streaming game services, not so much. Streaming games has tremendous potential synergy with advertising. Games are yet another form of media, after all. There is obvious tremendous potential synergy with YouTube. Also, if one can stream games, then why not stream other kinds of applications? There's tremendous…

Basically identical to youtube. Forget putting AAA games on it, imagine a massively improved version of the flash games that were popular a decade ago.

Forget putting AAA games on it, imagine a massively improved version of the flash games that were popular a decade ago.

I wouldn't be so confident about AAA games being a barrier. I guess AAA games emphasizing "realism" might always have a high-end PC niche, since the genre could always ramp up graphics to the point of un-streamability. I could also totally imagine, let's say, Nintendo, going whole-hog into streaming games with cartoony graphics, emphasizing multiplayer with friends. I don't see any reason why the industry couldn't target and achieve something like 30 ms round trip latency. So long as the gameplay is good, the potential audience for 1080P gaming with even last generation level graphics is huge.

To think they would be limited to the level of flash games is hugely naive.

Re: Google’s constant product shutdowns are damaging its brand

#289

Post by anoncake »

jedberg wrote: post #278
_ptgt wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my experience at a different FANG, the same culture exists here. If I had to guess, I would say it probably applies to the others as well.

It definitely doesn't apply to Netflix. You can get good raises and promotions by optimizing an existing process. If you can show improvement in internal metrics, such as improving latency or lowering cost, that's a huge win. Even if you increase costs you can get a raise and promotion if you show that it increased code quality, such as creating the Chaos Monkey/Gorilla/Kong.

I guess it helps that Netflix essentially has one product.

Re: Google’s constant product shutdowns are damaging its brand

#290

Post by user5994461 »

Animats wrote: post #255
jfasi wrote: post #61

Warning: Personal opinion ahead To understand why this keeps happening, you need to understand the product and engineering culture at Google. As a group, Google engineers and PMs are obsessed with promotion. At the heart of every conversation about system design or product proposal lies an unspoken (and sometimes spoken) question: will working on this get me promoted? The criteria for promotion at Google, especially…

Streaming game services, not so much. Yes. The game industry is very reluctant to use Improbable's Spatial OS, because, through a deal with Google, they force you to host your game, expensively, on Google's servers.[1] Nobody wants to spend $100 million developing an AAA title using that system, and then suddenly get an email that Google is discontinuing the product. (Spatial OS is technically interesting, and, hopef…

Game servers typically don't last more than a few years, even for an AAA game. They pretty much never last a whole decade outside of major MMORPG.

It's a bit surprising that the game industry would be scared of GCP going bust, given the short release cycle of the industry.

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