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Uber’s COO says it’s getting harder to justify money spent on tokenmaxxing

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271–280 of 360 posts

Re: Uber’s COO says it’s getting harder to justify money spent on tokenmaxxing

#271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

AFAIK they gave up on doing self-driving themselves a while ago. I'm sure they are still hoping to be able to get rid of human drivers somehow.

If they didn’t have human drivers, they’d have one less human to exploit per ride.

That's true, I guess possibly they figured out that humans using their own vehicles turn out to be cheaper than contracting or owning self-driving vehicles.

Re: Uber’s COO says it’s getting harder to justify money spent on tokenmaxxing

#272

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For example in Seattle you pay county fees, and then state fees, and then maybe special fees if you were picked up in the airport. I took a ride from SEATAC to my hotel in downtown Seattle and besides the ride itself, there were 5 other items on the bill, 4 of which are specific to the place I used Uber. Then I had the return trip from my hotel to SEATAC, on this one I got EIGHT items on the bill, on top of the ride…

Use Link next time. Only $3

Twice as long and walking with suitcases when my company's paying? No thanks.

Re: Uber’s COO says it’s getting harder to justify money spent on tokenmaxxing

#273
post #29

What if... we stop for a moment, and then, after thinking for a moment, we stop hammering nails with a microscope, and stop using token usage as a metric of productivity? I know it's sounds stupid, but what if

There is a complete lack of courage in the leadership of tech companies today, and top-down AI mandates are just another manifestation. True visionaries think outside the box, but most tech executives are forcing their employees into black boxes, out of fear of not doing exactly what their competitors are doing. We have lemmings for leaders, and that means that—much like the LLMs that are being shoehorned into everyt…

"True visionaries think outside the box,"

I mean that's more of an ex-post statement.

Ex-ante they look at things as objects and visualise/simulate what one ought to do independently, as opposed to being a lemming.

Re: Uber’s COO says it’s getting harder to justify money spent on tokenmaxxing

#274

I remember at Google at around 2007 - 2009, as Google was massively expanding its data centers, there was a lot of unused capacity, especially during off-hours. Any engineer could run as many jobs as they wanted at zero priority, which means the job would be first in line to be killed if a more important task needed the resource. I did so many interesting experiments with MapReduces that would run overnight. For a wh…

"Using a lot of tokens to debug an easy frontend bug that could have been fixed by hand, and still took you 4 hours to complete? Waste of tokens, should be discouraged."

Hahahah good luck with that!

For many of us, what is happening now was super obvious. Telling a new formed crack addict (who you wanted to become addicted) to be more thoughtful about their consumption of crack... yeah not gonna work is it.

Re: Uber’s COO says it’s getting harder to justify money spent on tokenmaxxing

#275

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They're not far off, getting the same seamless integration as hosted models is a full time job. I think what just happened is that devops is about to explode. What will naturally follow is local hosting of all the things when people realize subscription costs for cloud-whatever are absurd. Gitlab is going to take off? This is not investment advice.

> What will naturally follow is local hosting of all the things when people realize subscription costs for cloud-whatever are absurd. Even acknowledging we don't know exactly what costs would look like in a world without VC money, wouldn't hosting models logically be cheaper to do at scale in a data center? When I compared to the cost of running DeepSeek locally, I meant that we can treat that cost as a price ceiling…

Vscode uses undocumented api calls. Right now we are living through the PokémonGo api fiasco. That ended with paid keys and a mostly dead economy.

Re: Uber’s COO says it’s getting harder to justify money spent on tokenmaxxing

#276

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What will naturally follow is local hosting of all the things when people realize subscription costs for cloud-whatever are absurd. Even acknowledging we don't know exactly what costs would look like in a world without VC money, wouldn't hosting models logically be cheaper to do at scale in a data center? When I compared to the cost of running DeepSeek locally, I meant that we can treat that cost as a price ceiling…

Vscode uses undocumented api calls. Right now we are living through the PokémonGo api fiasco. That ended with paid keys and a mostly dead economy.

Sorry, can you fill me in? I don't see the connection.

Re: Uber’s COO says it’s getting harder to justify money spent on tokenmaxxing

#277

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I checked their history and they seem alright ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Here, just a few examples over the last 9 days, in no particular order of exaggeration magnitude: Unsubstantiated claims of 3x-10x productivity at allegedly a FAANG: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48174666 More claims of the same, still unsubstantiated: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48173995 Even more claims of the same, still nothing of substance: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48173975 Outlandish…

This is so cool, I have my own fan on HN that cherry picks my comment history to call me a shill!

Re: Uber’s COO says it’s getting harder to justify money spent on tokenmaxxing

#278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People talked about streaming years before Netflix. Online maps apps date back to the 1990s. E-commerce as well. I definitely get the impression that many people thought it would eventually create shopping, streaming, and mapping sites. I think people were less likely to have predicted things like social media or YouTube, though those weren't ideas sprung from a vacuum either.

If it were that simple and obvious, Blockbuster would have beat everyone to streaming. Sears would have digitized their catalog and used their vast brick-and-mortar stores as fulfillment centers for same-day shipping. None of these shifts were obviously the right bet and many organizations lost because they missed the opportunity. Now orgs are on the same horizon and I can see why they don't want to miss this window.

Blockbuster actually did try to beat everyone to streaming. Notably, Blockbuster and Enron [1] entered into a 20-year partnership for online video delivery.

Sears was a different story, in that they were a real estate company with a store front and retail real estate took a nosedive due to ecommerce. But that's a different discussion.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enron_scandal

Re: Uber’s COO says it’s getting harder to justify money spent on tokenmaxxing

#279
post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is a complete lack of courage in the leadership of tech companies today, and top-down AI mandates are just another manifestation. True visionaries think outside the box, but most tech executives are forcing their employees into black boxes, out of fear of not doing exactly what their competitors are doing. We have lemmings for leaders, and that means that—much like the LLMs that are being shoehorned into everyt…

There was an amusing post about judging developers based on token usage where some user on HN here was pushing this idea “ICs don’t like it but this is the best way to evaluate” (something like that). They have a whole management team and can’t seem to find a way to judge or god forbid encourage developers…

I don't get why it's so hard for management to see the good devs. All the devs know who are the good devs.

Re: Uber’s COO says it’s getting harder to justify money spent on tokenmaxxing

#280
post #29

What if... we stop for a moment, and then, after thinking for a moment, we stop hammering nails with a microscope, and stop using token usage as a metric of productivity? I know it's sounds stupid, but what if

> and stop using token usage as a metric of productivity I participate in some management-focused online communities. It’s crazy how many threads there are from frustrated managers trying to get their teams to stop thinking that their token use will be used as a proxy for their performance. I think a few dumb companies did this and then it spread across social media, triggering a mass panic from engineers afraid thei…

I can personally verify that Cisco does it and they're not exactly at the top of the food chain. It's probably more common than you think.
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