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Your phone is about to stop being yours

keepandroidopen.org

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Re: Your phone is about to stop being yours

#271

Post by xigoi »

selectively wrote: post #88
kodablah wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Saying there is no opt-out is just false I can't see where one can opt-out of this new behavior and into the existing behavior, only a description of the new behavior's bypass (which is not the same thing at all) > easy to bypass the cooling-off period with ADB I don't think this is a reasonable use of the term "easy". I should be able to give my non-technical friend an apk and they can use it right then, with the…

The way you give your non-technical friends an APK and they just install it is by you signing it.

And then having Google approve it, so hopefully your app does not do anything that Google does not like, such as block ads.

Re: Your phone is about to stop being yours

#272

Post by xigoi »

striking wrote: post #56
TGower wrote: post #52

This is a wild misrepresentation of the situation. Saying there is no opt-out is just false, they even provide the information on how users can opt-out. The "mandatory 24 hour cooling-off period" is also misleading, it's easy to bypass the cooling-off period with ADB.

And I kind of buy the intent behind the cooling-off period anyway. IIRC it's to prevent people from being pressured into installing apps by scammers that could then take their phones hostage

As if there are no scam apps on Google Play.

Re: Your phone is about to stop being yours

#273

Post by ubertaco »

zeta0134 wrote: post #87
criddell wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For you, is the openness of Android appealing as a matter of principle or does it enable you to do things you couldn't otherwise do?

I'll chime in with a really basic example. On my Android phone, I can have syncthing run as a background task. I can point other applications to use a data folder, in my syncthing share, and store their persistent state there. The Camera app, for example. Or Obsidian, my current favorite note taking app. Syncthing, by virtue of being always on and manipulating a decades old, very well understood filesystem concept, "…

This is the exact reason we switched my wife from iPhone to Android – because her iPhone couldn't sync reliably for our shared password vault or for Immich.

Re: Your phone is about to stop being yours

#274

Post by NDlurker »

criddell wrote: post #61
NDlurker wrote: post #30

>Android's openness was never just a feature. It was the promise that distinguished it from iPhone. Millions chose Android for exactly that reason. Google is now revoking that promise unilaterally, on devices already in people's pockets, because they've decided they have enough market dominance and regulatory capture to get away with it. This is why I've stuck with Android for the past 15 years.

For you, is the openness of Android appealing as a matter of principle or does it enable you to do things you couldn't otherwise do?

>For you, is the openness of Android appealing as a matter of principle or does it enable you to do things you couldn't otherwise do?

Both. I don't like the idea of locked down computers and that includes phones, especially now that they're so prominent in our lives.

I dabbled in Android development for fun a decade ago and I loved how there was no barrier to entry. I've loaded apps that aren't available on the Play Store and have loaded apps that my friends have made just as fun side projects.

There was a handheld gaming system in the early 2000s called Cybiko. Cybiko and Sega Dreamcast homebrew opened my mind up to the power of computers and having control of your hardware. These things should not be locked down. I liked messing around with making little programs on the Cybiko and downloading homebrew games for it and the Dreamcast. The openness of Android really excited me when it was new because I thought of it the same way as a Cybiko or Dreamcast or PC and not a locked down device where I can only run software approved by the hardware manufacturer.

Re: Your phone is about to stop being yours

#275

Post by 627467 »

mmooss wrote: post #49

There is a negative network effect: The opt-out is so complex and time-consuming that it will deter almost all users (even if some on HN say they will do it). With so few users, many fewer developers will release apps that don't comply with Google's requirements. Then the value of opting out will decline significantly, which will reduce the number of people doing it, which will reduce the number of apps released ...…

[dead]

Re: Your phone is about to stop being yours

#276

Post by alamortsubite »

HWR_14 wrote: post #143
tossit444 wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So you moved into a walled garden in an attempt to escape what's essentially a 3 foot picket fenced garden.

If there are two walled gardens, you might as well choose the prettier one.

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I use Android and iOS regularly and while Android's ugly, it's slightly less ugly.

Re: Your phone is about to stop being yours

#277

Post by Markoff »

tromp wrote: post #20
jjgreen wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From TFA: Delve into System Settings, find Developer Options Tap the build number seven times to enable Developer Mode Dismiss scare screens about coercion Enter your PIN Restart the device Wait 24 hours Come back, dismiss more scare screens Pick "allow temporarily" (7 days) or "allow indefinitely" Confirm, again, that you understand "the risks" Nine steps. A mandatory 24-hour cooling-off period. For installing softw…

You left out the crucial bit: Worse: this flow runs entirely through Google Play Services, not the Android OS. Google can change it, tighten it, or kill it at any time, with no OS update required and no consent needed. And as of today, it hasn't shipped in any beta, preview, or canary build. It exists only as a blog post and some mockups.

that seems better, not worse, that they don't implement this on OS level, so no gapps users are not affected at all

Re: Your phone is about to stop being yours

#278

Post by 627467 »

jmcomets wrote: post #15
bitpush wrote: post #3

Isnt the title a bit dramatic? I remember reading you can still install apps but you just need to click a few buttons.

From NewPipe : https://github.com/woheller69/FreeDroidWarn?tab=readme-ov-fi... I wouldn't consider this "a few buttons", it's enough to turn off the less savvy users

Less savy and unmotivated users.. maybe? Whats the main use cases for newpipe? Let me guess: get premium features for free (no ads, downloads etc).

Do you think people wont click 9 buttons and wait 24hs for this?

Its like people forgot how pirated windows/sw used to run on millions (billions) on devices in the past until ads (and some convenience from non-so-cheap-anymore subscriptions) became the norm

Re: Your phone is about to stop being yours

#279

Post by rootusrootus »

catlikesshrimp wrote: post #129
rootusrootus wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you are stuck in a walled garden either way, might at least try to get the benefits of it.

Includes status symbol and ecosystem lock!

If it is a status symbol, it really ain't working for me. I must be doing something wrong.
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