Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Microsoft faces antitrust scrutiny from the EU over Teams, Office 365

windowscentral.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

271–280 of 313 posts

Re: Microsoft faces antitrust scrutiny from the EU over Teams, Office 365

#271

Post by [deleted] »

impendia wrote: post #203
TeMPOraL wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, people at Microsoft just didn't realize most users forgot how to work with multiple windows. You can have a separate calendar window if you care for it, you can even read individual e-mails in separate windows (that one is annoyingly bound to double-click...). That works on the web too - at least for people realizing you can have the same app open in two tabs, and then break them out into separate browser windows…

My attitude -- and I acknowledge that this comes from a place of privilege -- is that I don't care to share my calendar with my employer. I'm a university professor; there's always pressure to join this or that initiative, to participate in more committees, and the like. But in the long term, success depends on maintaining much of my focus on my long-term research goals, which means saying no a lot. PG wrote about "m…

[deleted]

Re: Microsoft faces antitrust scrutiny from the EU over Teams, Office 365

#272

Post by tekla »

esafak wrote: post #266
AceyMan wrote: post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My parent corp guaranteed no one would use it as a knowleldgebase by implementing a 30-day maximum retention period in Slack. (Same for Teams chats). Lots of our staff got caught out when all the channels got truncated. Oof.

Not sure if that counts as a success or a failure. More like a failure because you learn after wasting a whole month. And then everybody has to learn the same lesson.

Success. It got everyone to stop using slack as a knowledge base.

It's like when sysadmins get confused when people use the recycle bin as storage and the user gets angry when the bin gets cleared.

Re: Microsoft faces antitrust scrutiny from the EU over Teams, Office 365

#273

Post by toyg »

marcosdumay wrote: post #248
toyg wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I see the need for a body for enterprise integration standards. Both ISO and IETF could and should do that. IETF in particular seems to be less effective than it used to be - an RFC used to mean something, to carry some weight, but now they're often just words into the void.

> used to mean something, to carry some weight When was that? AFAIK, the great differential of RFCs is that they never carried any weight, and as a consequence the process wasn't taken over by entrenched interests.

They carried weight with the people trying to make this shit work, down in the trenches. It wasn't a perfect process, but it was a process - geeks trying to talk to each other, beyond bullshit corporate boundaries.

I don't think anyone really wants to talk to anyone anymore.

Re: Microsoft faces antitrust scrutiny from the EU over Teams, Office 365

#274

Post by tacotacotaco »

justinclift wrote: post #166
TeMPOraL wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I must be an unique snowflake, because I switched jobs around March 2020, and the new place used Teams exclusively, and... it was good. Not stellar, but good for the standards of software in this decade. Better than Slack, anyway. There were some weird glitches happening couple times a year, but nothing major. So either I'm incredibly lucky, or - my going hypothesis - Teams actually does work quite well, if you deplo…

"Incredibly lucky" this time around I'm thinking. :) Oh, are you using it on an Apple Silicon mac?

Not the OP but I do run Teams on Apple Silicon and it is still a bug-ridden mess. Crashes, rendering bugs, file attachment bugs. At least once a week, usually more. Searches fail to find results that I can manually locate by scrolling through the chat history. I have reinstalled the app more than once.

I have shared these observations in their feedback pop ups and I know Microsoft loves collecting telemetry. Why should they dedicate more money/resources to fix defects when it clearly hasn’t stopped them from growing their market share?

Teams is the first example I use to begrudgingly explain to someone that quality doesn’t matter.

Re: Microsoft faces antitrust scrutiny from the EU over Teams, Office 365

#275

Post by NekkoDroid »

skc wrote: post #82
theonlybutlet wrote: post #34

I can't understand how Apple keeps getting away scot-free, considering this type of scrutiny exists and how their services work.

Maybe it's hard to muster the enthusiasm to punish a company when you yourself are such a huge fan of their products.

Contrary to the US, in EU Apple isn't that popular.

Re: Microsoft faces antitrust scrutiny from the EU over Teams, Office 365

#276

Post by cameronh90 »

dmonitor wrote: post #238
TeMPOraL wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I must be an unique snowflake, because I switched jobs around March 2020, and the new place used Teams exclusively, and... it was good. Not stellar, but good for the standards of software in this decade. Better than Slack, anyway. There were some weird glitches happening couple times a year, but nothing major. So either I'm incredibly lucky, or - my going hypothesis - Teams actually does work quite well, if you deplo…

looking at my teams interface right now. there are three separate "..." menus. Behind one of them is the settings, one is the installed apps, the third is to install more apps. Everyone involved in the decision making process that resulted in this UX should be banned from computers.

In my anecdotal experience, the less technical users have a much easier time with Teams than they do with Zoom.

I suspect it depends on what you're used to. Zoom fits in better with the Apple design system.

Re: Microsoft faces antitrust scrutiny from the EU over Teams, Office 365

#277

Post by TeMPOraL »

impendia wrote: post #203
TeMPOraL wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, people at Microsoft just didn't realize most users forgot how to work with multiple windows. You can have a separate calendar window if you care for it, you can even read individual e-mails in separate windows (that one is annoyingly bound to double-click...). That works on the web too - at least for people realizing you can have the same app open in two tabs, and then break them out into separate browser windows…

My attitude -- and I acknowledge that this comes from a place of privilege -- is that I don't care to share my calendar with my employer. I'm a university professor; there's always pressure to join this or that initiative, to participate in more committees, and the like. But in the long term, success depends on maintaining much of my focus on my long-term research goals, which means saying no a lot. PG wrote about "m…

> My attitude -- and I acknowledge that this comes from a place of privilege -- is that I don't care to share my calendar with my employer.

Neither do I. Fortunately, my employer doesn't care about it anyway.

> Outlook feels designed around the manager's schedule.

That is 100% true.

However, relevant to this entire thread, it's typical to put "focus time" blocks on the calendar. If you set your free/busy status to "busy" on those blocks (which is the default anyway), then come focus time, MS Teams and Outlook will both show you as "busy" / unavailable for the duration. A little bit of automation, but it does a good job at deterring casual interruptions, as anyone who tries to "invite you" to a meeting, or ask you "a small question, 30 seconds tops" will have their Outlook tell them there's a scheduling conflict, and their Teams that you should not be disturbed and won't get the notification anyway.

Re: Microsoft faces antitrust scrutiny from the EU over Teams, Office 365

#278

Post by TeMPOraL »

xigoi wrote: post #262
TeMPOraL wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Will it allow my calendar to automatically attach Matrix/Element video calls to every appointment invite? Will it chime when such appointment is about to start? This is the kind of stuff that corporate customers care about. They want systems that integrate well.

> This is the kind of stuff that corporate customers care about. They want systems that integrate well. Great. I just want a system that allows me to view a PDF file that my teacher sent me without having to click through a dozen menus and wait several minutes.

Yes. That's what you get from a well-integrated system. At work, I can open PDFs and Excel sheets and Powerpoints directly within Teams with a single click (and, one or two extra clicks to download an off-line copy).

Re: Microsoft faces antitrust scrutiny from the EU over Teams, Office 365

#279

Post by TeMPOraL »

idkyall wrote: post #180
TeMPOraL wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Per the article, it seems that it's Slack that's been making the noise and pushing for this, and EU is just playing ball (perhaps because of the mercantilism you mention).

But Slack is owned by Salesforce, a US company

But both Slack and Microsoft operate in the EU market as well. Slack is trying to buy itself some breathing room by convincing the EU to go after Microsoft.

Re: Microsoft faces antitrust scrutiny from the EU over Teams, Office 365

#280

Post by TeMPOraL »

justinclift wrote: post #166
TeMPOraL wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I must be an unique snowflake, because I switched jobs around March 2020, and the new place used Teams exclusively, and... it was good. Not stellar, but good for the standards of software in this decade. Better than Slack, anyway. There were some weird glitches happening couple times a year, but nothing major. So either I'm incredibly lucky, or - my going hypothesis - Teams actually does work quite well, if you deplo…

"Incredibly lucky" this time around I'm thinking. :) Oh, are you using it on an Apple Silicon mac?

Nah. Just a random Thinkpad.

I think Apple Silicon is going to one's experience worse here, not better - because of the "Apple" part.

Post reply on HN