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MusicGen: Simple and controllable music generation

ai.honu.io

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Re: MusicGen: Simple and controllable music generation

#271
post #262

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is an absolutely massive gulf between "free (or fixed list price) and immediate, just use these apps" and "locate a musician, bargain with them, pay, collaborate with them, wait for revisions, eventually get something usable (but not be 100% sure if I own the rights or not)." I wouldn't even know where to start; I'm too far out of my league. Tackling the latter would likely exceed the entire effort I spent writ…

It's not that hard, you find an email and you basically do a cold call. I was doing it in high school off Newgrounds (which is full of royalty free stuff too!) If your project is small and free, you're not going to land The Eurythmics. But all those people posting their music online hoping to get noticed? Emailing them, even a cold call, immediately tells them you've listened to their stuff and you like it. Honesty i…

> stipulate it in writing ... proper contract

When it's just me and some apps, I'm writing the background track in an evening after coding the game earlier in the day. If I bring someone else in, now I'm writing contracts (something I'm completely unprepared to do correctly myself, as a non-lawyer). It's too big of a jump for a one-day zero-budget hobby game that isn't very good and only my friends will play. Not when I can quickly cook up something myself using readily available tools.

For a more serious project with a budget, absolutely you find a professional producer, just like you get professional coders and artists. But this isn't that.

Re: MusicGen: Simple and controllable music generation

#272
Do any of these generative music ML framework export as midi instead of .wav or .mp3? That would be 1000x times more useful as the quality we're reaching is good enough.

I can imagine an VSTi that just takes a prompt and generates midi tracks. Something like this is surely coming in the next couple of years.

Re: MusicGen: Simple and controllable music generation

#273
post #45

I don’t understand what’s motivating certain types of people to continue working on these types of AI practical implementation projects. There’s nothing good for the world this (type of AI in particular) will offer. Maybe someone will say this will let people who aren’t musicians express themselves by creating music. That’s not true. It’s as true as hiring a musician to make a song for you, given a description. And n…

> I don’t understand what’s motivating certain types of people to continue working on these types of AI practical implementation projects. There’s nothing good for the world this (type of AI in particular) will offer.

Man wants to dominate nature and always has. I don't think this is particularly difficult motivation to understand, as it seems omnipresent.

Re: MusicGen: Simple and controllable music generation

#274
post #205

(This is not meant to be an anti-ai-generated-art rant. It's coming whether we like it or not. But some of the motives in this thread confuse me.) Music producer here with an honest question to those saying "this will provide me with a simple soundtrack/background music for $PROJECT" Have any of you checked out / made offers on music production subreddits? Or other music subreddits? various music production discords?…

> Have any of you checked out / made offers on music production subreddits? Or other music subreddits? various music production discords? Elsewhere on the internet?

When it's 3 am on a Saturday and I'm in the zone on a passion project, I'm not about to spend the rest of the weekend going back and forth with a music guy on Reddit.

I want a music robot that cranks out music on demand and responds to my every whim, and a real human being isn't going to want to fill that role no matter how impoverished they are.

Re: MusicGen: Simple and controllable music generation

#275
post #205

(This is not meant to be an anti-ai-generated-art rant. It's coming whether we like it or not. But some of the motives in this thread confuse me.) Music producer here with an honest question to those saying "this will provide me with a simple soundtrack/background music for $PROJECT" Have any of you checked out / made offers on music production subreddits? Or other music subreddits? various music production discords?…

If I need a background track for something, and I commission someone else, then I believe the standard contract for the commissioned work would still leave copyright with the producer (though not always), and changing it so that I have exclusive rights to the work would potentially make it more expensive.

Add to that, if I don't like something, want it tweaked, want something completely redone, or just flat out change my mind about some direction I provided later, I have to go back to them and negotiate a new contract, or find someone else to do the work. The costs add up over time, and there's an additional benefit to immediate feedback (or cost of delayed feedback, as anyone who has worked on a software project that takes forever to compile/check can attest)

I haven't used the music AI tools yet, but having played around with Dall-E a bit I can say that it's pretty enjoyable to be able to give direction, and bound it, then roll the dice and see how things turn out. I definitely feel some ownership of, and pride in, the resulting creation

Re: MusicGen: Simple and controllable music generation

#276

The question that I think tells the kind of potential that ML has for music is, how good is written language in describing music? People here compare this to the development of Stable Diffusion, but the mediums are quite different. Describe your favorite shot in a movie and most likely you’ll enumerate and get pretty far in conveying it to someone who hasn’t seen it, at least the physical aspect of it. But try descri…

> The question that I think tells the kind of potential that ML has for music is, how good is written language in describing music?

If you took a DAW project file of a song.wav that was completely written and produced digitally using virtual instruments and compiled all of the parameters a user had to set to achieve their output.wav into a .csv file, you may be surprised to see (1) how few parameters were used (2) how often those parameters are unchanged from their defaults and (3) the amount of those parameters that would be expected in any other project file.

When you break it down, you really only have 6 layers to parse, all of which are dynamic but within a relatively small and consistent sandbox, at least relative to image generation.

1. composition layer - the midi or notes of the song. 2. arrangement layer - the selection of instruments used in the song and the division of the song's midi to the song's respective instruments. 3. instrument layer - the parameters of each instrument, such as a synth path or a virtual piano's room setting. 4. post processing layer - the effects placed on the output of each instrument, such as reverb, compression, delay, ect. 5. mixing layer - the volume of each instrument + post processing channel 6. mastering layer - processing on the master track

All of these things are more or less standardized. Developers always add their own flair (read: custom parameters) for their plugins, but they can be decompiled to be a composition of each of these layer's fundamental parameters. All these parameters + the midi of a song would be a few kb

I feel like a LLM trained on the parameter sets which interacts with the software used to manipulate these layers could really produce amazing tools and open the door to writing high quality songs to everyone, just as other AI products have opened so many similar doors.

The DALL-E app for music, in my mind, probably wont be a text based description -> .wav output. Instead, it would be the generation of the elements of each layer with options that can be listened to in real time using whatever VSTs were used in training. When you ask ChatGPT to write a complex python script, it starts with an outline of all the methods in the script as placeholders and then takes you step by step until you're done, then you troubleshoot it or flesh it out. The best part of a generative music like this is that it leaves the user really only with having to decide if something sounds good or not.

As a mostly musically illiterate producer myself, I've produced hundreds of songs and a few albums without ever really learning how to do anything other than manipulate the parameters. When I started learning to produce music I was 15 years old and knew nothing about music production. But, I was really good at was using computers and software so I learned to play the DAW, the plugins, and the sample packs. The only layer that I couldn't learn through learning software was the composition, the writing of the midi. Fortunately, the midi of a song becomes very easy to brute force over time, so I learned to brute force midi. Once I became efficient with my workflow, producing music became a task of "make this idea sound good." And without ever really feeling like I was a musician or composer, this became an enormous passion and outlet for me that I did every day for a decade.

I was able to do this because at its core, all the mechanical parts of a song are simple machines and a song's quality is the way those machines are used together. As an outside, this feels like a workflow that would be very machine learning friendly. But I could be wrong!

Re: MusicGen: Simple and controllable music generation

#277

I mean this is shockingly good. The longer “lofi” example at the bottom sounds like it could have been a Boards of Canada demo. I’m very impressed.

On sound quality, yes. But neither this nor any of the others offered for comparison feels creative in the slightest.

By contrast OpenAI's JukeBox, which is maybe two years old now, really comes up with fascinating ideas.

Re: MusicGen: Simple and controllable music generation

#278

I'm just weirded about the fact that conversation about something AS EPIC AS THIS is so boring and rudderless here on hacker news of all places. I mean like YESTERDAY I did not have this superpower to summon something as majestic as say https://fb.watch/l4ssOD40M4/ with a simple 'A quirky and skronky Aphex twin sample that just hits you' Edits: I woke up to this news delivered from Yann Lecun himself in the morning o…

Writing about music is like dancing about architecture

This quote always makes me wish someone would give dancing about architecture a good try.

Re: MusicGen: Simple and controllable music generation

#279

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> hey invent new genres for every song, they wear Metallica t-shirts in 2023, and they mix 80s disco with 00's Brit rock like it's just what people do. If this appeals to you, it's worth checking out Japanese music from the Showa era to present. They've long mixed styles in a way other music markets have not. You can hear city pop songs from the 80s with metal guitar solos, jazz progressions a samba beat and synths,…

Hey wow cool! Got any representative sample to recommend?

I like Mari Hamada, Meiko Nakahara, Akina Nakamori, Misato Watanabe, Seiko Matsuda, Saki Kubota, Yoko Oginome and definitely check out Juicy Fruits!

Re: MusicGen: Simple and controllable music generation

#280

Maybe I'm just getting older but I feel like the quality of both music and film has seriously declined over the last 5-10 years. Maybe the good stuff is still out there but lost in a sea of average garbage that has surfaced to the top. Something tells me AI isn't going to rescue us either. I just sampled a bunch of these generated tracks and they immediately remind me of the average, mediocre, soul-lacking content th…

Counterexample: https://on.soundcloud.com/d6rX9goHHrSH3sQY9 I agree with you. When gwern investigated AI folk music in 2019, I realized it could generate a wonderful variety of music, full of soul. Be sure to listen to several tracks before making up your mind. My favorite is “crossing the channel”, since I think GPT made a mistake at the beginning, and then generated the most reasonable sounding not-mistake, which t…

This is the best generated music I've ever heard. Are you blogging about your project? Where can I read more about your methods?
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