Adobe charges subscription cancellation fee • Hacker News Board

Re: Adobe charges subscription cancellation fee

#271

Post by brailsafe » Tue, Apr 13, 2021, 7:07 AM UTC

d110af5ccf wrote: post #174

dunnevens wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When you lease an apartment or a car, the monthly rate stated is usually the actual month-to-month cost. They don't demand a full year in advance to get the stated cost, or increase the monthly cost because you didn't pay for a year upfront. That's why this pricing feels dishonest, even if it's technically true. Other companies handle it much more fairly. If you want to subscribe to World of Warcraft, Blizzard makes…

> They don't demand a full year in advance to get the stated cost, or increase the monthly cost because you didn't pay for a year upfront. In my experience, typical apartment leases are offered on a 12 month basis. Month to month is usually substantially more expensive. If you break a 12 month lease early, you're legally on the hook for whatever the contract specifies (typically the entire year in my experience). Mos…

I've personally never heard of a case where you'd pay out the year's lease. Usually you just forfeit a portion of your deposit, which half a month's rent or so, in Canada at least.

Re: Adobe charges subscription cancellation fee

#272

Post by martin_a » Tue, Apr 13, 2021, 7:08 AM UTC

hansvm wrote: post #223

Mandatum wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

True, my views are non-American. For example when I go to a convenience store, I pay the price listed on the item. I don't have to do math in my head that's +x% sales or state tax. That type of practice just isn't acceptable anywhere else.

It's even enshrined into law in some states and locales. A few businesses have tried to market themselves as "no-nonsense, no-bullshit" and put the right prices on things, but that's totally illegal in parts of the US.

Funny. I find this to be something I appreciate and look out for when buying things or services in Germany, even if it's more expensive.

Re: Adobe charges subscription cancellation fee

#273

Post by [deleted] » Tue, Apr 13, 2021, 7:08 AM UTC

syntactic-sugar wrote: post #204

wlesieutre wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The dark pattern is the first page pretending it’s a $52/month rate when the actual monthly rate is priced much higher. If they want to honestly advertise that price then it needs to say “billed monthly with annual contract.”

Absolutely. It's not a $52/month rate because it's not 52 dollars per month. The moment you click that buy button you're on the hook for $624. IMO A less deceptive label would be $624, billed in monthly installments.

[deleted]

Re: Adobe charges subscription cancellation fee

#274

Post by tolbish » Tue, Apr 13, 2021, 7:09 AM UTC

wlesieutre wrote: post #95

paxys wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To me this is a very intuitive presentation of pricing, so not sure what you are referring to as a dark pattern. There are three clearly laid-out options: 1. No contract, pay monthly 2. Annual contract, pay monthly (cheaper than 1) 3. Annual contract, pay in one go (cheaper than 1 & 2) You pick one of the three options and check out. Where exactly is the confusion?

The dark pattern is the first page pretending it’s a $52/month rate when the actual monthly rate is priced much higher. If they want to honestly advertise that price then it needs to say “billed monthly with annual contract.”

"Twelve easy payments"

Re: Adobe charges subscription cancellation fee

#275

Post by JumpCrisscross » Tue, Apr 13, 2021, 7:09 AM UTC

paxys wrote: post #168

culturestate wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> if a debt goes to collections that ends up on your credit report. It's not like you can just ignore it forever. I obviously don't endorse this, but in the US you absolutely can ignore it forever as long as it isn't student loan debt. Anything else large enough to sue for can be discharged through bankruptcy (which is comically simple in some states), and debts below that[1] will fall off your report after 7 years.…

Tanking your credit has very real consequences if, say, you need a home loan in the next 7 years. You'll end up paying for that $100 "savings" x 1000 in the long run.

> Tanking your credit has very real consequences if, say, you need a home loan in the next 7 years. You'll end up paying for that $100 "savings" x 1000 in the long run

Coïncidentally (and anecdotally), I was recently proximate to a situation where a new hire had their offer cancelled on account of their credit report. It became clear they had a habit of entering into and defaulting on small contracts. Nothing obscene. But enough that, as a financial services firm, the employer found it to be an unacceptable risk. If that person were sued in any capacity, that fact pattern would come to light and illuminate them in a negative light.

Re: Adobe charges subscription cancellation fee

#276

Post by piva00 » Tue, Apr 13, 2021, 7:11 AM UTC

cbmuser wrote: post #227

paxys wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You will have access to 100% of the service if you hold up your side of the contract you signed.

Exactly. It’s a contract. If you cancel it early, the other contract partner has the right to get a compensation fee. That’s perfectly normal and also practised by other companies.

It's unusual for B2C subscription services to charge a cancelation fee and withhold access for the remainder of the period.

It's another mental obstacle for the customer to overcome on the sunken cost fallacy, it's slimey at best.

Re: Adobe charges subscription cancellation fee

#277

Post by [deleted] » Tue, Apr 13, 2021, 7:11 AM UTC

Mandatum wrote: post #61

greggman3 wrote: post #50

Is this really a cancellation fee or is it just honoring your contract? AFAIK it's very clear on Adobe's page that your options are (1) Annual plan paid monthly, (2) Annual plan prepaid, and depending on the product (3) Monthly plan at usually 150% higher price. https://www.adobe.com/creativecloud/plans.html If you signed up for a yearly plan paid monthly, the cancellation fee is finishing your contract. If you didn'…

This is disingenuous at best, and fraudulent at worst - and I know ACCC in Australia will take a very dim view. Take the main page for instance, the one you linked - it lists monthly prices. No mention whatsoever of "annual pricing paid monthly" - it's JUST monthly mentioned. Pic: https://imgur.com/sZPfFDI When you click "See plans and pricing details" it gives you the Annual monthly and ACTUAL monthly prices. Pic: h…

[deleted]

Re: Adobe charges subscription cancellation fee

#278

Post by amatecha » Tue, Apr 13, 2021, 7:13 AM UTC

sherry-sherry wrote: post #46

johnsocs wrote: post #6

When you sign up you agree to the fee being broken up in installments. I think they have spelled it out pretty clearly, actually one could consider it ‘free’ financing in a sense. While I don’t like what they have done I don’t see what the big deal is with it.

This: https://imgur.com/a/yQFQRKF is what you see when looking at prices and after clicking Buy Now. It says "annual plan, paid monthly", but doesn't state the fee, it vaguely mentions the price. Clicking 'learn more' does not tell you the fee. It think it's deceptive, at best.

I mean, what I see is: A$76.99/mo

The word "annual" doesn't even appear on the first screen anywhere. It's even very easy to miss the word "annual" on the little dropdown on the checkout screen (2nd screenshot). If you are in a rush, it's VERY easy to see numerous line items for "$___/mo" and miss the single instance of the word "annual" in this entire checkout flow.

Where is the link to an agreement that the user has to read to even complete this purchase? Is it just on another step elsewhere in the process?

Re: Adobe charges subscription cancellation fee

#279

Post by watwut » Tue, Apr 13, 2021, 7:14 AM UTC

hansvm wrote: post #223

Mandatum wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

True, my views are non-American. For example when I go to a convenience store, I pay the price listed on the item. I don't have to do math in my head that's +x% sales or state tax. That type of practice just isn't acceptable anywhere else.

It's even enshrined into law in some states and locales. A few businesses have tried to market themselves as "no-nonsense, no-bullshit" and put the right prices on things, but that's totally illegal in parts of the US.

That sounds like regulation - except anti-consumer one.

Re: Adobe charges subscription cancellation fee

#280

Post by chrisandchris » Tue, Apr 13, 2021, 7:16 AM UTC

Aeolun wrote: post #177

greggman3 wrote: post #50

Is this really a cancellation fee or is it just honoring your contract? AFAIK it's very clear on Adobe's page that your options are (1) Annual plan paid monthly, (2) Annual plan prepaid, and depending on the product (3) Monthly plan at usually 150% higher price. https://www.adobe.com/creativecloud/plans.html If you signed up for a yearly plan paid monthly, the cancellation fee is finishing your contract. If you didn'…

Yeah, I was prepared to be outraged, but when I saw the pricing page I had to agree that it’s really, really obvious what you are signing up for.

Can‘t speak for the current page but some year (1 actually) I signed up for a monthly plan to extract some InDesign into SVG/PDF.

After I was done, I cancelled the plan and Adobe mailed me something like „sad to see you go here‘s a free month“.

What I didn‘t know and did not see ond the sign-up page was that I actually signed up for a YEARLY plan and I had to pay a huge cancellation fee. There was no indiciation or mentioning of a yearly contract (ok, maybe sonewhere deep down and so small nobody can read it).

IMHO, I was tricked into this yearly plan and had to pay much money to get out. It was the day I swore never to pay for Adobe products again.