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Nvidia Limits RTX 3060 Hash Rate

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Re: Nvidia Limits RTX 3060 Hash Rate

#271

Post by Filligree »

j1dopeman wrote: post #151
gruez wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a common sentiment I see on discussion forums, but I think it's wishful thinking at best. Most consumers aren't enthusiasts that follow these types of news, and even the ones who do probably won't care/remember a few years down the line. After all, nvidia seems to be doing just fine despite their long history of anti-consumer practices over the years.

I think they run the risk of people giving up on pc gaming completely or never getting into it in the first place. A market that has and should be growing will shrink instead.

This is already happening. I have friends who would, in other circumstances, be building gaming PCs right now, so we could play games together, but–

It's simply not possible.

Re: Nvidia Limits RTX 3060 Hash Rate

#272

Post by M277 »

gsich wrote: post #161
chrisseaton wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can still render without a display port and use the output image to for example stream it to another display.

You need another GPU for that. Not really practical.

I don't know about that. Plenty of people are using Intel non-F CPUs which have iGPUs.

Honestly, the worrying part is that NVIDIA may block this. If I remember right, they did something similar back in 2017 with the P106 mining cards (GTX 1060 equivalent) when people bought them for cheap.

Re: Nvidia Limits RTX 3060 Hash Rate

#273

Post by PartiallyTyped »

dahart wrote: post #253
MAGZine wrote: post #244

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If they just put these chips into regular cards then they could eventually be resold, to gamers, at a great price. Instead, during a global silicon shortage, nvidia is producing silicon that has one use and then into the trash.

You’re making a huge assumption that they could be resold, even if they’re the same chips. This could be an entirely new market for chips that have yield defects in the graphics units, that will not ever work for games, and were previously already put in the trash. And your theory doesn’t explain two things: - how this hurts gamers now, and - why if Nvidia just wanted profit and the chips are useful for games, why wo…

> And your theory doesn’t explain two things: - how this hurts gamers now, and - why if Nvidia just wanted profit and the chips are useful for games, why wouldn’t Nvidia simply do nothing and let the miners buy all the 3060s. Wouldn’t that be the most profitable thing here?

No it is not. If they mis-predict when the mining craze ends, they will be stuck with a huge inventory and no way to deal with it. The reason they will be stuck with the inventory is because the miners will be able to sell the second hand cards at a rate that NVDA simply can't compete with, so they end up as the bag holders just like it happened with the 1xxx series.

Infact, I'd wager that DLSS and RTX were used as a hacky solution to drive people away from the 1xxx series because the 1xxx series was more than sufficient for 1080p gaming - which is the most common resolution. The 3xxx series, even the 3060 is an overkill even for 1440p let alone 1080p.

This, to me, suggests that had NVDA not gimped the hashrate of the 3060, once the craze was over and the market was flooded with 2nd hand 3060, people would not be incentivised to buy anything above a used 3060 because it is a) an overkill for 1440p@120hz and b) it has much higher perf/$ than anything NVDA could offer with the 3xxx or 4xxx series and it wouldn't make any sense to go with anything higher anyways because 4k gaming doesn't seem worth it unless you are playing on a TV.

Re: Nvidia Limits RTX 3060 Hash Rate

#274

Post by deepakhj »

windexh8er wrote: post #252
SSLy wrote: post #245

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No one mines bitcoin on GPU's anymore, since 8? years.

Yeah this just isn't true. Given the rally in coin prices GPU mining has come back to the black if you have cheap/free access to electricity. With a 3080 you can make over $12/day in BTC and the electricity costs required are less than $2 in a majority of the US [0]. [0] https://www.nicehash.com/profitability-calculator/nvidia-rtx...

Btc mining only works on asics. You can mine ethereum on gpu’s.

NiceHash rents your hash rate to buyers, you mine ethereum, while they pay your rewards in btc.

If you want ethereum directly, you can mine for a pool like ethermine or flexpool.

Re: Nvidia Limits RTX 3060 Hash Rate

#275

Post by AnHonestComment »

locuscoeruleus wrote: post #264
cmeacham98 wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mining cards are run near always, while gaming cards are usually pushed only a small number of hours per day. I have no data to back this up but anecdotally this makes a huge difference in wear.

Huge difference in wear, yes. But not in the direction you think, I think. Warming up an cooling down is more damaging for a card than running constant temperature. It 'jiggles' parts more.

That seems true of structural components but untrue of silicon, where the heat output difference is literally the GPU being jiggled more aggressively inside by the miner.

Heat dissipation is due to jiggling the tiny gates a little every time you fire one: which cycle much more often in the mining case — at a higher temperature, where there’s more likely to be damage.

Re: Nvidia Limits RTX 3060 Hash Rate

#276

Post by Retric »

R0b0t1 wrote: post #194
Retric wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That depends on how valuable the last 5% of your hash rate is and local electricity prices. Running an OC especially for memory can objectively be the correct choice. For collage dorms for example rarely charge based on electricity use. Some apartment complexes also include electricity as part of the rent.

Power cost is not typically something people consider when deciding to overvolt. Have you ever done any mining? Most people prioritize the longevity of the cards. Resale value is not negligible.

Yes though I stopped. At 22c/kWh it’s 2$/year per watt. Which makes a huge difference when optimizing your setup and cooling.

Re: Nvidia Limits RTX 3060 Hash Rate

#277

Post by mbajkowski »

agumonkey wrote: post #208
vimy wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can electronics actually wear out?

One phenomenon I know is electromigration, changes in the material structure that modifies its electrical property. Another less related to electronics, is simple heat cycles.

Additionally, transistors can experience aging through various mechanisms [1], some of which are permanent and some of which can be fixed with a reset. Most manifest via a shift in threshold voltage of the transistors, which can impact the operating frequency of chips or stability of sensitive circuits such as memory cells. When ICs are designed they usually have a lifetime operating profile, i.e 5y or 10y with max voltage and operation for x% of that lifetime at a given temperature. Simulations are then run pre and post degradation to ensure requirements can be met. Different fabs such as tsmc and samsung will provide models/info for the transistor aging as part of their design tool kits.

[1] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transistor_aging

Re: Nvidia Limits RTX 3060 Hash Rate

#278

Post by mlyle »

roter wrote: post #259
arcticbull wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The CMP version is a straight-to-landfill product. As soon as it stops being profitable for mining it will have zero resale value, and become e-waste. Like literally every other piece of Bitcoin or crypto mining technology. It’s straight to the landfill every 6 months. Bitcoin generates 100 GRAMS of ewaste for every transaction. Every 2 transactions consumes as much energy as driving a Tesla from SF to NY [edit for…

I checked your numbers against [0]. Road distance NY -> SF = 2900 miles [1]. Model S mileage is 290Wh/mi [2]. That is 840kW for Tesla against 657kW for a single transaction. This is all order-of-magnitude stuff but... wow. [0] https://digiconomist.net/bitcoin-energy-consumption/ [1] https://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=road%20distance%20san%... [2] https://www.zeviecars.com/browse-cars/tesla-model-s

kWhr, not kW. It's also 1/2 to 3/4th the electricity used in a month by a typical US household.

Re: Nvidia Limits RTX 3060 Hash Rate

#279

Post by somehnrdr14726 »

At some point nvidia would be better off mining with these gpus than selling them.

The oddest solution I can think of is gamers lease graphics cards at a low low price and nvidia mines on them in the off-hours. With a big enough operation they could force all the other miners into becoming resellers. It's free, distributed electricity and it gets the gamers off their backs.

(While I have your attention, I'm pretty sure proof of work is the paperclip maximizer sci fi warned us about.)

Re: Nvidia Limits RTX 3060 Hash Rate

#280

Post by deepakhj »

throw14082020 wrote: post #86
lwhi wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree. It's a bad move. Provide a better product for mining .. don't cripple what's out there. This feels similar to when Nurofen tried to repackage generic drugs for different types of pain. I.e. ultimately a branding exercise. -- Edit: spelling and s/paracetamol/generic drugs

I appreciate this move to make GPUs more available for non-crypto users. As someone who wants to buy an AMD GPU to run my Ryzen machine, I have been waiting 2 weeks because there is no supply of GPUs at the RRP price. I can only buy the 2 year old models for double the price they sold for.

There’s a global chip shortage due to

1) covid-19. Factory closures, employee, and supply chain issues. 2) 30-40% growth in gaming due to covid-19 3) trump tariffs (for the USA). Gpu exemption expired in January.

Crypto is affecting prices but they aren’t causing the supply issues. I don’t think amd has produced many 6800/6900s. Ryzen 5800/5900 cpus are rarely in stock.

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