Schools should start using Linux more.
I agree, we complain about the lack of STEM grads and CS education then we give them a web browser and some "Apps" to learn computing. Heading in the wrong direction.
Apple’s Devices Lose Luster in American Classrooms
271–280 of 335 posts
Re: Apple’s Devices Lose Luster in American Classrooms
#272Earlier quoted context omitted.
Thanks for clarifying. I agree that Chromebooks are not the ideal learning device for coding. I was thinking general schooling and glossed over your earlier comment about teaching coding. I think they can probably work there, but you're right that a "real" computer is a better choice for that.
I'm running a coding class right now that is almost entirely run over ssh on chromebooks to a linux server. Works beautifully. No fancy IDE, but lots of actual learning to code.
What are they writing code with? Is it lots of learning to code, or lots of fighting with vim? Or are you using a REPL?
Re: Apple’s Devices Lose Luster in American Classrooms
#273I'm a HS teacher. I was so happy when my school finally phased out iPads as the designated device for our year 7 students. It's such a rubbish device for content creation. The touchscreen is a POS for anything other than web browsing and casual games. Teaching coding, image manipulation, file manipulation was utterly painful or impossible. Typing on them is beyond painful and of the hundreds of students I taught, few…
For the topics of stuff like coding, image manipulation, file manipulation, etc... would a raspberry pi cover your teaching needs (That IS what they were made for).
The pros I see would be: size, price, similarity to desktop environment vs iOS
The potential flaws I see would be: Linux isn't windows, speed (maybe for image manipulation an issue?), not mobile (this would have to be an a computer lab), would require someone to set up.
Re: Apple’s Devices Lose Luster in American Classrooms
#274I'm a HS teacher. I was so happy when my school finally phased out iPads as the designated device for our year 7 students. It's such a rubbish device for content creation. The touchscreen is a POS for anything other than web browsing and casual games. Teaching coding, image manipulation, file manipulation was utterly painful or impossible. Typing on them is beyond painful and of the hundreds of students I taught, few…
There's two strong separate issues here:
1. pricing, no-brainer.
2. The two sometimes noticable conflicting goals of making no/low-effort admin computers and teaching kids to handle computers/do general things with them
nr2 there's no all-around answer to but my bias is towards something like the chromebook atleast even if execution might be flawed.
Re: Apple’s Devices Lose Luster in American Classrooms
#275Finally. It was always so hard to see schools spend millions on expensive Apple tech when there was equivalent equipment available for half the price that met their needs equivalently well. We really don't need to be spending $400-500 per tablet to outfit a classroom with 1 device for every 3 kids, when each kid really needs their own.
I question the underlying premise that " each kid needs their own". Every time there's a pilot program that gives every kid a laptop or tablet, it seems to be a complete failure after a few months. My aunt is a teacher in a public school district, and has seen a number of such programs come and fail over the decades.
Its really situational.
Every student at my school was given a laptop (2005, but that practice started years earlier) - but we were in a special situation being a boarding school. Every student having a laptop meant that teachers could reasonably expect every student to write/research papers, install/run software, use email, etc - on their own time (nights/weekends/study times, etc).
My laptop lived in my dorm room, and if I needed it for a class or to go study somewhere I could take it - but that was a 2-3 times a week thing, not every day and certainly not every class. Day (non-boarding) students had it a bit rougher, as they were bringing their laptops back and forth from home every day, lugging them around from class to class.
Even in 2005, I don't think campus could have operated with the efficiency it did without every student having a laptop. Important information was sent out via email constantly (Lotus notes...), BlackBoard for class documents, lecture notes, etc.
But that was our situation. At a day school, I imagine technology is probably a nightmare. If 1 class each day needs kids to have a laptop, that means every student is walking around with their laptop all the time for no good reason. Sounds like a recipe for failure.
Not to mention the effect of "students have this technology so let's go out of our way to use it whenever we can"
Re: Apple’s Devices Lose Luster in American Classrooms
#276Earlier quoted context omitted.
This is so nice to read after having seen my sister's children receive laptops at school. No one was actually giving them any system knowledge. No programming, no "how does a computer work, what is a file...", no support/teaching on how software can help when e.g. writing an essay. Nothing. They were carrying 10+ kg (no joke) in their bags every day because of course they were forced to bring the (heavy) laptop to ev…
Same with my kids' schools. iPads handed out to every kid, but incredibly, they were incompatible with the online Math textbook selected. Millions spent on technology for its own sake, without any real plan. Honestly I think paper, pencils, and books are still the most effective tools for most primary education.
Sounds like the "online Math textbook" was the main problem. How on earth would that not be compatible with an iPad. What the hell was it?
Re: Apple’s Devices Lose Luster in American Classrooms
#277I'm a HS teacher. I was so happy when my school finally phased out iPads as the designated device for our year 7 students. It's such a rubbish device for content creation. The touchscreen is a POS for anything other than web browsing and casual games. Teaching coding, image manipulation, file manipulation was utterly painful or impossible. Typing on them is beyond painful and of the hundreds of students I taught, few…
I've been skeptical of mobile devices in the classroom for awhile now. They just seem like distraction machines. Which I admit sounds weirdly luddite for someone who makes a career working with technology.
I think you are right to be skeptical. In my experience (sitting near/behind students with laptops in class), the laptops are used more for web browsing than for note taking. This distracts multiple people because your eyes can't help but look at the laptop every time the screen changes. My experience is from college and graduate school. But, I can only imagine that high school students are more prone to distraction and will always be able to find the next chat/messaging client before administration blocks it.
Re: Apple’s Devices Lose Luster in American Classrooms
#278I'm a HS teacher. I was so happy when my school finally phased out iPads as the designated device for our year 7 students. It's such a rubbish device for content creation. The touchscreen is a POS for anything other than web browsing and casual games. Teaching coding, image manipulation, file manipulation was utterly painful or impossible. Typing on them is beyond painful and of the hundreds of students I taught, few…
My kids used iPads at a previous school and I was initially thrilled, but that faded immediately when I saw one of them trying to type an essay on it. I think iPads can be useful tools for some things (reading, studying, learning), but even with an external keyboard they suck for writing/creating anything.
> Chromebooks are rubbish too, so I don't really see the move to them as a positive either.
You get what you pay for with Chromebooks. The school my kids are at now started giving Chromebooks to older kids and the initial ones were seriously underpowered with terrible low-res screens. We ended up buying my oldest an Acer Chromebook for $300 (https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00MHX6TIA/). It has a full HD screen and can actually handle multiple tabs and apps running in the background.
For anything other than a serious programming class I would highly recommend Chromebooks for schools, but you need to push for a usable one.
Re: Apple’s Devices Lose Luster in American Classrooms
#279Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Also, where do you live/teach? "Year 7" I'm in Australia. Nationally we are transitioning to a R-6 = Primary School, 7-12 = High School model. My school is a little unorthodox. We're a private school with a 6-12 shared campus which is why I had experience teaching younger students even though I am HS trained. > What to your mind would not be rubbish? Either Mac or PC is fine in my books. Anything that allows them t…
Wow, that's impressive. Computer education in the 80-90s in the US seems somewhat lacking by comparison. For me 3-5th grade was Oregan Trail, 6-8th was Mavis Beacon Teaches Typing, and 9-12th was typing using the Edit command in Dos and saving to a floppy.
I think it depends on where you were. I was in Minnesota and we had these guys: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MECC
We had LogoWriter in elementary school. We were programming at a very young age without really knowing that's what we were doing. (We also had this typing software with monsters or something that was easily gamed; it didn't check for errors. So you could type quickly, erase everything you typed, then type it correctly and you'd get something like 350 wpm.)
(I moved to a new district between elementary and middle school.)
In middle school I vaguely recall doing some kind of programming on commodore 64s.
In high school we had a BASIC programming class and also an AP Computer Science class in which we learned a little bit about programming Pascal. Some students did an independent study to learn C, but failed miserably - probably had no real support.
But honestly, I learned the most when I would stay overnight at my cousin's house and hack away at my uncle's computer (PC w/ I think MS-DOS) unsupervised. I broke it a few times, but was always terrified enough to figure out how to fix it. He had a few manuals, and I went through trying all kinds of commands. Figuring out why UNDELETE never worked taught me a bit about how hard disks were used by the OS, stuff like that.
Re: Apple’s Devices Lose Luster in American Classrooms
#280Earlier quoted context omitted.
Ah interesting, thanks for the perspective. I'm surprised nobody has build any local management software for chromebooks, but maybe Google makes it difficult.
Not sure what grandparent means by local management software, but Google's built a cloud device management console ( https://www.google.com/intl/en/chrome/business/devices/featu... ) and there are 3rd party tools (ex. GoGuardian - who works with my company - https://www.goguardian.com/ ) that help manage devices.
I mean something that would allow management and storage locally instead of on Google's cloud. We have some requirements by law. I haven't heard of GoGuardian, thanks for the info.