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No skin thick enough: The daily harassment of women in the game industry

polygon.com

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Re: No skin thick enough: The daily harassment of women in the game industry

#261

Post by Jemaclus »

wutbrodo wrote: post #230
Jemaclus wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Oh brother... Ha. I don't mean that I don't want a daughter... It's just that every time I think about having a daughter, I think about these issues, and it scares the shit out of me. Raising a son, I wouldn't have to worry that much about this stuff, and I could focus on helping him help make the world a better place, instead of worrying about whether my daughter is gonna get raped because she wore short shorts to…

> Raising a son, I wouldn't have to worry that much about this stuff, and I could focus on helping him help make the world a better place, instead of worrying about whether my daughter is gonna get raped because she wore short shorts today. I understand the comment you made (downthread) about parents being perhaps irrationally concerned about low-probability dangers to their kids, and totally understand: what I don't…

I didn't say it was a rational fear. You are not wrong. :)

Re: No skin thick enough: The daily harassment of women in the game industry

#262

Post by Zikes »

Rudism wrote: post #251
Zikes wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pretend for a moment we're in some crazy mirror world where whites are frequently mistreated, in ways that many well-meaning blacks don't see. In this world, it makes sense for a white to lecture those well-meaning blacks about empathy - to ask them not to tell whites how to feel - because they're just missing some basic information. No, wait, that would be racist. But your version magically is not sexist? Edit: To t…

I think you're being downvoted because you may have misunderstood the parent comment and replied with an analogy that makes no sense.

There is no misunderstanding. The parent comment is trying to reinforce the practice of pitting the genders against each other and continues to argue that men need condescendingly "lectured" on the matter.

My change in wording is meant to show how ridiculous a notion that is. Sexist remarks in articles such as this are getting a free pass because at one time feminism served a purpose, and today's hypersensitive political-correctness puts it above reproach. But when you take those same statements and put them on an axis of racism, their nature is revealed.

Re: No skin thick enough: The daily harassment of women in the game industry

#263

Post by [deleted] »

Fomite wrote: post #220
oldmanjay wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Clearly my downvoters have never been insulted while suicidal

Or, more likely, believe that any circumstance where being called fat or dorky is a serious threat to your well being will also be a circumstance where people musing about your rape and death will be a serious threat to your well being. Especially as, for women, body shaming and rape threats often come hand in hand.

[deleted]

Re: No skin thick enough: The daily harassment of women in the game industry

#264

Post by mperd »

Steko wrote: post #106
Zikes wrote: post #26

This is the sort of journalism I would expect to find on Jezebel, rather than Polygon. Filled with us vs. them mentality: no man can understand, men all think this, men always tell us that. Men never deal with harassment, death threats, or rape threats. Well, here's a little variation on Hitchens' Razor: what can be proven with anecdotal evidence can be dismissed with anecdotal evidence. http://www.edge-online.com/fe…

Am I wrong that this would have been the top upvoted comment on HN 5 years ago? If so maybe that counts as a tiny bit of progress/small strides. Or maybe this will be the top voted when I come back later, /sigh...

I haven't been reading HN for that long, but I'm rather impressed that this thread didn't get that much similar comments. I think it shows community maturity and also that these subjects are getting through in the IT crowd.

Re: No skin thick enough: The daily harassment of women in the game industry

#265

Post by hackuser »

shrnky wrote: post #247

How does the Feminist movement square itself with the fact that many women actually like being prized for their beauty and sex appeal? I'd like to start a campaign called "It's cool." It would require some form of an indicator. A sticker or button perhaps? Women who like having their beauty and/or sex appeal noticed could wear it on their person. Posters with these women could have it on display. Men would know, "It'…

> How does the Feminist movement square itself with the fact that many women actually like being prized for their beauty and sex appeal?

I didn't see any mention of appreciating beauty and sex appeal. I read an article about rape threats, degrading comments about appearance, and objectification of women. I don't know if you mean to equate those things, but they are not equal. Also, 'prizing' women is objectification (though perhaps you didn't mean that literally) -- people aren't trophies or racehorses -- complimenting someone when they are receptive to it is just nice.

Comments about beauty and sex appeal also can be a way to attack women. For example, if you were a woman my comment here could be 'don't worry your pretty little head about it' or simply 'wow you have great tits -- can I sleep with you?'

Re: No skin thick enough: The daily harassment of women in the game industry

#266

Post by Zikes »

mperd wrote: post #264
Steko wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Am I wrong that this would have been the top upvoted comment on HN 5 years ago? If so maybe that counts as a tiny bit of progress/small strides. Or maybe this will be the top voted when I come back later, /sigh...

I haven't been reading HN for that long, but I'm rather impressed that this thread didn't get that much similar comments. I think it shows community maturity and also that these subjects are getting through in the IT crowd.

You're impressed there weren't more comments like mine? Can I ask what it is about my comment that you did not like?

Re: No skin thick enough: The daily harassment of women in the game industry

#267

Post by cheez »

tonypace wrote: post #234
cheez wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not what I said either. I said: "sometimes it feels like a woman-in-tech's workday must go something like this according to the articles I see" How was this article titled? It didn't say "online harassment of female authors in the gaming industry" which is what it is actually about. The title tried to lump in every woman in the gaming industry, a common tactic. So I get to make my own generalizations just as w…

She didn't identify the other women whose stories she told. It's an assumption that they're all writers. I think you're reading too much into her tone. The key point is that no skin is thick enough to shrug off this treatment, and it's common for various unidentified women and one identified one in the industry to receive it from the general public. Do you think that's true, or not?

> Anita Sarkeesian once reblogged a Tumblr post of mine and it ended up on Reddit. I got so much hate mail from dudes that I left the internet for three days,

Unfortunately, hate for Anita Sarkeesian will transfer to her associates.

> Nicole Tanner is a former editor of IGN, and was one of the founders of "Girlfight.

Editor/writer. Don't know what Girlfight is.

> Every time I'm interacting with an enthusiastic fan

Another public figure

> Carolyn Petit is an editor for GameSpot.

Editor

There are no anonymous developers here (save for the reblogged post). This is clearly public figures in tech. I'd assume there are less public female figures in tech than there are non-public women in tech.

As for telling them to develop a thick skin, I have no opinion on that. If you are a public figure, you will be subject to this kind of behaviour.

The title of the post pisses me off. If they had just said "Online harassment of female authors", I'd have no complaint to make. But it is clickbait.

Re: No skin thick enough: The daily harassment of women in the game industry

#268

Post by ThomPete »

mperd wrote: post #260
ThomPete wrote: post #252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I worked in advertising for a number of years. Men are presented primarily in one of 4 ways. 1) Handsome 2) Stupid 3) Authority 4) Bro Men are presented as objects just as women are, that is how you sell in 20 seconds.

If you consider an object as something to be acted upon, of the 4 ways of representation you cited, only the first usually applies. Other ways of representation, in the examples I can think of, are often of active characters, either the corporate alpha male, or the frat-house bro. Sure, these are simplifications and stereotypes of men, but I don't think they can compare to the objectification of women through their s…

I think they do.

Re: No skin thick enough: The daily harassment of women in the game industry

#269

Post by ThomPete »

hackuser wrote: post #256
ThomPete wrote: post #252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I worked in advertising for a number of years. Men are presented primarily in one of 4 ways. 1) Handsome 2) Stupid 3) Authority 4) Bro Men are presented as objects just as women are, that is how you sell in 20 seconds.

> Men are presented as objects just as women are, that is how you sell in 20 seconds. It's not the same, because women are politically/socially much more vulnerable. If you are one woman in an office of 10 men, one of the men objectifying you is a threat, but not vice-versa. If you are blue in a world run by green people, constant advertisements objectifying blue people is threatening, but not those objectifying gree…

Men are found in the top and the bottom of society. Men are much more likely to be wrongfully accused of incest or sexual offending children.

It's not the same I agree. But men are equally vulnerable just about other things.

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