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Why did I leave Google or, why did I stay so long?

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Re: Why did I leave Google or, why did I stay so long?

#261

Post by Mauricebranagh »

itg wrote: post #24

Another "leader" who complains about employees wanting work life balance and they are extremely entitled. These are the type of managers you want to avoid. I'm sure many Googlers are happy you left.

Yeh the whine about hiring and firing was a dead give away - given the low level of employee protection in the USA.

Sounds like the author a senior leader (presumably) hasn't internalised what it is to lead - I recall a tweet from a serving Army officer about what you must never do is get used to the fact you can send out some one for coffee and become entitled.

Re: Why did I leave Google or, why did I stay so long?

#262

Post by travisgriggs »

andrew_ wrote: post #225

It's astounding in so far as how unique this conversation is to tech. I've worked as a pipefitter, electrician's apprentice, and general construction hand in the past - I could only imagine how it would go telling my former foreman that I'd like to head off to yoga in the morning for an hour. Big jobs that require overtime to complete get folks to work that overtime - even within a union. If it's not you, it's someon…

This. The article author describes a number of symptoms. Viewed through my lens of abstraction, he's arguing about passion for the job/product/team. People who are passionate about what they do are often frustrated when surrounded by those less passionate.

I notice in some of the comments either in support of or against this guy, there's a subtle distinction. Those against say things like "I'd never work for this guy." And those more supportive, say things like "I'd like to work with this guy."

I see in tech often that there are those who want to view it as an idyllic "team play" game. We're all on the court together trying to score goals. And there's another segment that see it in the more traditional factory worker. Clearly defined roles, chains of report, advancement up the pyramid.

Re: Why did I leave Google or, why did I stay so long?

#263

Post by enraged_camel »

andrew_ wrote: post #225

It's astounding in so far as how unique this conversation is to tech. I've worked as a pipefitter, electrician's apprentice, and general construction hand in the past - I could only imagine how it would go telling my former foreman that I'd like to head off to yoga in the morning for an hour. Big jobs that require overtime to complete get folks to work that overtime - even within a union. If it's not you, it's someon…

>> We have it AMAZINGLY WELL being in tech, and we have luxuries that are unique to tech and bewildering to folks in other fields.

Yep, even other highly paid fields! Can you imagine a surgeon scheduling their surgeries around yoga classes?

Re: Why did I leave Google or, why did I stay so long?

#264

Post by selimthegrim »

sct202 wrote: post #118
tejohnso wrote: post #59

> It is practically impossible to fire someone for the basic reason that you don't need this role any more or there is a better person I found this surprising. I thought this was primarily a problem in union / government positions.

It's how it works at most big companies. There's a very big impact to morale if people think they'll get sacked at the end of a big project or if VP's best friend needs a job. The normal way to onboard a new better person is to open up a new position, like repurposing an open headcount from somewhere else, and then shift responsibilities between the new person and old person.

EA apparently hasn’t gotten this memo

Re: Why did I leave Google or, why did I stay so long?

#265

Post by david38 »

andrew_ wrote: post #225

It's astounding in so far as how unique this conversation is to tech. I've worked as a pipefitter, electrician's apprentice, and general construction hand in the past - I could only imagine how it would go telling my former foreman that I'd like to head off to yoga in the morning for an hour. Big jobs that require overtime to complete get folks to work that overtime - even within a union. If it's not you, it's someon…

Overtime is remembered a lot less than you think. I have family in the trades and they much prefer their union jobs to my programming one.

Yes, I get paid more, but I also work more, in an area where I can’t afford a house.

Re: Why did I leave Google or, why did I stay so long?

#266

Post by [deleted] »

madeofpalk wrote: post #74
itg wrote: post #24

Another "leader" who complains about employees wanting work life balance and they are extremely entitled. These are the type of managers you want to avoid. I'm sure many Googlers are happy you left.

"I don't believe long hours are a badge of honor but I also believe that we have to do whatever it takes to win, even if its on a weekend." lmao what a terrible, horrible manager. I would hate working for them, and I would not miss them leaving. Maybe I'm just playing into their "young people don't want to work" stereotype, but if that's what working means, I don't want to do it with them.

[deleted]

Re: Why did I leave Google or, why did I stay so long?

#267

Post by kmeisthax »

itg wrote: post #24

Another "leader" who complains about employees wanting work life balance and they are extremely entitled. These are the type of managers you want to avoid. I'm sure many Googlers are happy you left.

Yeah, I was sort of getting what they were saying until they started complaining about political correctness. If you don't explain what you were being censured or censored over, I'm just going to assume it's some vile sexist or racist remark, because 9 times out of 10 that IS the quiet part.

I'm starting to think the Bay Area trend of hyperfocusing on identity politics is just the trendy way of deposing shitty managers.

Re: Why did I leave Google or, why did I stay so long?

#268

Post by duxup »

Aromasin wrote: post #229
duxup wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's such a weird dynamic. I remember visiting the valley for the first time for a big company I worked for at another location. The scale of work life balance was unbalanced so many strange ways... The tech support team I worked with was in 'building 3'. Nobody ever left that building through out the day. I went to the big cafeteria and the options were amazing. I managed to get some of my peers to go with me, sever…

I noticed this when I worked at my first "employee satisfaction" focused company. Half the employees took every perk they could get, seemingly doing as little work as they could under the mantra of "work-life balance". The other half never left their desks. It created a strange dynamic of resentment between the two parties, where one thought the other stupid, and the other thought them lazy. It was hard to know where…

I once worked for a team was historically over worked, that had changed recently for the better, but the team culture was still pretty stressed and nose to the grind stone. We were working to bring that down, but it takes time.

The offices were being renovated and our team was moved next to HR.

HR formally complained (apparently there was a process... where HR sent some sort of complaint to ... HR) that the team sitting next to them was not very friendly.

Before what I can only imagine would have been a horrific joint team meeting / culture clash could occur, someone very smart put the kibosh on the complaint / meeting ....

The culture / work experience differences were extreme.

Re: Why did I leave Google or, why did I stay so long?

#269

Post by curiousllama »

> Any idea we had was quickly co-opted by Google Maps ... Looking back, we could have probably grown faster and much more efficiently had we stayed independent.

This is a great example of the difference between startup people and big company people. A big-company exec would have known to (how to?) fight that battle. Waze was a superior product, while Maps just had superior resources: they should have built support. But there's no mention of other execs.

As a big company guy, I read this and think "oh man..." - I can only _imagine_ how frustrated this guy must be

Re: Why did I leave Google or, why did I stay so long?

#270

Post by lifeisstillgood »

>>> Perhaps Corp-Tech should move to employee share buy back where employees must sacrifice some of their salary for equity or change equity to vest by a product related metric to connect the teams performance with the employee returns.

Wow. It would have to tie into making upper management Pay-for-performance linked to similar metrics ;-)

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