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CD Projekt Conference Call with the Management Board [pdf] (Dec 14)

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Re: CD Projekt Conference Call with the Management Board [pdf] (Dec 14)

#261

Post by ddoolin »

dawnerd wrote: post #148
syndoch wrote: post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The game has an overwhelming amount of very detailed content in the main job and side jobs, and also provides plenty of flexibility in combat if you explore the various upgrade systems. It's an evolution of the Witcher 3, not Grand Theft Auto. Better driver AI and haircuts would be cool, but they're not central to what the game is.

> Better driver AI and haircuts would be cool, but they're not central to what the game is. The problem though is the AI is outright stupid right now, and that does affect the game. It doesn't have to be groundbreaking, it just has to not break. Enemies that can see you through a door or try to shoot through the floors is a problem - and probably why performance is so bad.

Agreed. I think the AI could use a lot of work. I notice most enemies have some kind of "approach distance" where they won't come any closer. Perhaps it's intentional but if enemies never come closer to engage, at any point in time or their HP, I can just hide behind something a few meters away and pick them off with quickhacks and headshots, even when they're completely aggro'd.

Re: CD Projekt Conference Call with the Management Board [pdf] (Dec 14)

#262

Post by willis936 »

john_minsk wrote: post #141
wmichelin wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think they'd care about sales rather than their stock price. The stock price will bounce back, and with the game being on sale, I'd imagine many players will just hold off until patches come through. They probably made more money launching as is than they would have if they had just waited.

A sign that Investors in this company are not looking to build long term fundamental business. They are there only to rip off immediate profit. Too bad.

Is this not a fundamental truth of shareholder value theory? No one should be surprised when a duck quacks.

Re: CD Projekt Conference Call with the Management Board [pdf] (Dec 14)

#263

Post by akhilcacharya »

voter101 wrote: post #189
akhilcacharya wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> My biggest complaint is that the game is totally dumb and a complete waste of time to those more philosophically inclined. What are some modern games that are like this? I came looking for something to scratch my Deus Ex 1 itch and I’ve so far been satisfied. Not terribly engrossed in the world, but otherwise not disappointed.

New Deus Ex games (Human Revolution and Mankind Divided) are pretty good.

Hard disagree, I’ve played through both multiple times and was disappointed with how they presented and discussed the metastory even though the gameplay was far more polished and fluid. My favorite part of Deus Ex was the conversation with the bartender [0]. There’s at least one similar, if dumbed down conversation in 2077 but I admire that they at least tried.

[0] https://youtu.be/JKF0IYwhrjk

Re: CD Projekt Conference Call with the Management Board [pdf] (Dec 14)

#264

Post by Godel_unicode »

aspaceman wrote: post #109
fastball wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did you not know about the tokens when you were hired? Why is your first reaction to "riot" instead of just "quit"? Unless it's in your contract, you don't deserve a bonus.

Because I want to. It’s my job, and I’d like to keep it. I take great pride in my position. I do graphics programming myself, and those jobs aren’t exactly numerous. Quitting is for cowards.

> Quitting is for cowards

No, quiting is for people who want something they don't have. Loss-aversion is a very powerful force, especially in the hands of senior leadership.

Re: CD Projekt Conference Call with the Management Board [pdf] (Dec 14)

#265

Post by willis936 »

zyemuzu wrote: post #193
_cs2017_ wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Investors don't make money from sales. They just lost 30% of their investment. Literally no one benefited from this.

I feel like I did. Playing on a 3080, minor bugs I've experienced aside it has been a true taste of the next generation of games. Mostly in a visual sense though.

Ah yes. You can see the global illumination ray traced lighting specular reflections off of the face of a T-posed one-line-of-dialog hooker.

Re: CD Projekt Conference Call with the Management Board [pdf] (Dec 14)

#266

Post by willis936 »

icedchai wrote: post #185
_cs2017_ wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd think this was worse for the investors than not releasing in December and delaying until ~March? Stock price down over 30%.

It may be good for investors getting in now , however. I picked up a few shares.

You are betting that CDPR will put in its due dilligence to regain trust of consumers. If they fail to deliver in the next 12 months, future sales will be bad. It’s rather pathetic that consumers give such leeway to irresponsible management.

Re: CD Projekt Conference Call with the Management Board [pdf] (Dec 14)

#267

Post by Godel_unicode »

spamizbad wrote: post #240
pavlov wrote: post #7

This company has probably the shittiest gamified bonus system that I've ever heard of: "CDPR leaders would hand out tokens every month to staffers who went above and beyond, and those tokens were supposed to be transferrable into bonuses if the game met “certain criteria, like critical acclaim and a timely release,” according to the report." [1] Get paid in "crunch mode experience points" handed out by middle manager…

Why is this sort of practice so common with video game studios but not elsewhere in the technology industry?

This is well-trod ground, but it's common with any job where the supply/demand ratio is severely in the employers favor.

Not a ton of those jobs in tech, but the dynamic is frankly pretty similar to professional cheerleaders. Lots of people want the job, relatively few of them, and the skill floor isn't all that high.

Re: CD Projekt Conference Call with the Management Board [pdf] (Dec 14)

#268

Post by ddoolin »

akhilcacharya wrote: post #122
elgatonegro wrote: post #117

I completed it twice -more out of boredom and getting my money's worth than actual enjoyment- and my biggest complaint is that the game is totally dumb and a complete waste of time to those more philosophically inclined. It feels like a throwback to the dumbest action games of the 90s: here's a main story and a bunch of quests that you'll be completing on railtracks. Your choices don't really matter, the world is emp…

> My biggest complaint is that the game is totally dumb and a complete waste of time to those more philosophically inclined. What are some modern games that are like this? I came looking for something to scratch my Deus Ex 1 itch and I’ve so far been satisfied. Not terribly engrossed in the world, but otherwise not disappointed.

NieR: Automata is like that.

Re: CD Projekt Conference Call with the Management Board [pdf] (Dec 14)

#269

Post by FeistySkink »

mgarym wrote: post #220

I've had the misfortune of interacting with some of the engineers at CD Projekt Red in the course of my job in the past. There is a serious competence issue. It's not surprising in the slightest bit that they have this many problems with their release. On top of that, those engineers were arrogant AF when I talked to them.

I'm genuinely curious, do you have more details?

Re: CD Projekt Conference Call with the Management Board [pdf] (Dec 14)

#270

Post by ballenf »

Tade0 wrote: post #134
pavlov wrote: post #7

This company has probably the shittiest gamified bonus system that I've ever heard of: "CDPR leaders would hand out tokens every month to staffers who went above and beyond, and those tokens were supposed to be transferrable into bonuses if the game met “certain criteria, like critical acclaim and a timely release,” according to the report." [1] Get paid in "crunch mode experience points" handed out by middle manager…

Good practices in management are still developing in Poland, unfortunately. Many companies around here do experiments like this one hoping to see improvements. Most of such attempts fail miserably. I've seen my share of weird, counterproductive ideas from grades like in school to work logged down to the second. My last company, even though it was over 500 people strong, was basically winging it.

I think the hardest part about running such "experiments" is ever knowing whether they were success or failures. Even here, we (and I doubt CDPR) don't know enough to really judge whether the tokens things helped or hurt. Or if it helped, whether it helped as much as a more traditional system. Except for small experiments that can be run many times (or in many similar departments in parallel), circumstances just change too much to ever compare apples to apples. (Here, devs may have loved this game's concept so much that they worked hard in spite of the tokens. Or didn't love the game concept but loved the tokens.)

Frankly it's why it doesn't make too much sense to veer very far from practices proven to work. But what's shown to work in a HBR studies may not apply in a different cultural landscape than the US.

All that being said, I'm sure there are many possible practices that are better than traditional approaches. It's just risky trying to find them.

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