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Amazon deletes job listings for analysts to track ‘labor organizing threats’

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Re: Amazon deletes job listings for analysts to track ‘labor organizing threats’

#261
post #258

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Each location should have its own union, grouping them all up allows the needs of the few to get drowned out by the wants of the many, and elevates union leadership to a position of power over the workers as union reps have easier access to spread their messaging to employees across locations while normal employees can only organize within their location.

>>> corpitized unions (anything union organisation bigger then 1 location of 1 employer) are goons. > Each location should have its own union You might as well go all the way, and condemn any union with more than one member. The whole point of a union is to have an organization representing the workers that has enough power to negotiate with the employer as a relative equal. Your "single site" unions would be pointle…

[deleted]

Re: Amazon deletes job listings for analysts to track ‘labor organizing threats’

#263

Beyond the creepiness of the tasks required, what sticks out to me is the persistent use of Amazon-specific jargon: > Analysts must be capable of engaging and informing L7+ ER Principals (attorney stakeholders) Does anyone who doesn’t work at Amazon know what “L7 + ER Principals” means? Perhaps these are universally understood terms in some fields, but my guess is that the “error” was posting this publicly, and it wa…

A quick search shows that L7 also exists at Facebook and Google at least. It's a senior (staff) software engineer. https://www.levels.fyi/company/Google/salaries/Software-Engi... Not sure about the ER part though.

Re: Amazon deletes job listings for analysts to track ‘labor organizing threats’

#264

Beyond the creepiness of the tasks required, what sticks out to me is the persistent use of Amazon-specific jargon: > Analysts must be capable of engaging and informing L7+ ER Principals (attorney stakeholders) Does anyone who doesn’t work at Amazon know what “L7 + ER Principals” means? Perhaps these are universally understood terms in some fields, but my guess is that the “error” was posting this publicly, and it wa…

I see this a lot in job postings; they often use internal language that you need to somehow learn to translate. This is particularly true with positions, which makes no sense because you then need to figure out what exactly “L7” is relative to the scale you have in your head.

Re: Amazon deletes job listings for analysts to track ‘labor organizing threats’

#265

Not surprised. Tech companies (Facebook and Google in this case, and probably others) have been known to retain Pinkerton agents to monitor employees. Yes, those Pinkertons. “Among other services, Pinkerton offers to send investigators to coffee shops or restaurants near a company’s campus to eavesdrop on employees’ conversations.” https://newrepublic.com/article/147619/pinkertons-still-neve...

This is awesome in a very very sad way. Several years ago, I started working for a company that was in the build up to a Yea/Nay vote for joining the union. During that time, 2 "goons" showed up at my apartment to discuss the benefits of joining the union and why not joining would be bad. However, these very "intelligent" goons showed up during the day, you know, working hours where I had a very low chance of being h…

I wouldn't be so quick to jump to the conclusion that they were _actually_ union. They may very well have been. But companies have a long, proud history of playing VERY dirty tricks in response to unionization.

A former boss of mine once bragged about how he killed a union effort at a previous job. He worked a corporate job for a chain of restaurants that was threatening to unionize. He was given the task of showing up pretending to be a union-affiliated, bafflingly incompetent asshole. He went to individual employees to discuss the "benefits" of joining the union, because in a group he was more likely to be called out by somebody actually union-affiliated.

Re: Amazon deletes job listings for analysts to track ‘labor organizing threats’

#266
post #241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, but you're already treading in murky legal waters. Just this posting could be viewed as Amazon trying to create the impression that it is actively surveilling labor organizing activities, which it's illegal to suggest, even if you're not actually engaging in that practice.

What is illegal in surveilling employees during work hour on workplace or on work device? It's not like amazon is bugging the house of workers. In all the companies I worked, I am pretty sure I signed contract allowing that. It's a different story that I have technical ability to turn off all the remote disable/access software they install on my work device.

It is, apparently, the case that creating an environment where a reasonable person would feel surveilled is in violation of the law.

Concrete things that are highlighted as out-of-bounds:

1) Putting a dummy security camera in a breakroom

2) Hiring someone to sit in a car in the company parking lot and pretend to talk into a phone every time someone goes to their car

Given that wide constraint, I can definitely see how "hiring an intelligence analyst who would specifically be tasked with keeping the company high-level leadership informed about labor threats to the company" could be interpreted, reasonable-person-wise, as the company surveilling organized labor. I don't think it's the slam-dunk some are describing it as, but it's, if you will, "a bad look."

Re: Amazon deletes job listings for analysts to track ‘labor organizing threats’

#267

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems perfectly fine and honest to post a job listing and then take it down hours later due to backlash, claim it was a mistake, and refuse to answer follow-up questions on it? What part of that sounds honest to you?

This is their business. This is how they want to run it. We can either boycott them or not. I have worked most of my life in mega big corporations, and I cannot say "oh I didn't know that bankA did this and bankB did that". I am either stupid, complicit or indifferent. Amazon will look after Amazon's interests (aka the shareholders). The little people have rights defined by laws. As long as they are not breached, Ama…

Some things businesses do have been made illegal. Perhaps this might be one of them.

Re: Amazon deletes job listings for analysts to track ‘labor organizing threats’

#268
post #259

It's so nice to know they group "organized labor" in with "terrorism" and "geopolitical issues." I will never purchase anything from an Amazon-related company.

>"organized labor" in with "terrorism" and "geopolitical issues."

For sure, all three are bad for the online shopping business...long live the unlimited capitalism!!

BTW: When did you heard "Freedom Fighter" the last time in the "Free Press"?

Re: Amazon deletes job listings for analysts to track ‘labor organizing threats’

#269
post #16

Having been a part of a union I was mandated to enter when I took the job until the supreme court ruled that wasn't legal, actual unions are a far cry from how they are portrayed as helping the worker. I would honestly do anything in my power to not have to work in a union again. They are set up as antagonistic between administration and workers, and adds a layer of bureaucracy that I've only seen be negative. I've w…

Some people like unions, I think because they're lucky enough to have had a good experience, or to be part of a union that was not decayed by age or special interests. Unions should not be needed... the governments who represent the people working should provide the necessary protections for workers without unions being needed. Unions are a way for some people to get what all workers should have by default.

Some workers are happy about some of the things unions championed. Like 5 day work weeks.

Re: Amazon deletes job listings for analysts to track ‘labor organizing threats’

#270
post #78

Whenever unions are mentioned on HN there always seems to be a coordinated effort to attack them in the comments, very interesting.

> Whenever unions are mentioned on HN there always seems to be a coordinated effort to attack them in the comments, very interesting.

I doubt it's a coordinated effort, it's just resident libertarians getting agitated by a concept they've been conditioned to fight against.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Californian_Ideology

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