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Rethinking the App Store

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Re: Rethinking the App Store

#261

Post by panzagl »

zacwest wrote: post #177
panzagl wrote: post #166

The most important changes Apple needs to make would not cost them a single line of code- they just get rid of their policy to require consistent pricing across all platforms, and allow promotion/linking of external (i.e. not on iOS) payment sources. If Spotify could charge +30% for a subscription purchased through the App store, and include a link to their main sign up page where subscriptions are regular price, eve…

The consistent pricing requirement was removed years ago. This is an article from 2011 about it: https://appleinsider.com/articles/11/06/09/apple_backs_down_...

Did not realize that, thanks.

Though if you're forced to add in-app purchases and cannot advertise the other method it seems somewhat moot.

Re: Rethinking the App Store

#262

Post by benologist »

TheNorthman wrote: post #249
benologist wrote: post #235

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The carve-out is for user-generated content but Netflix and Apple Music are not user-generated content and they do not even try to meet the requirements imposed on UGC. https://developer.apple.com/app-store/review/guidelines/ If they're not UGC then they're violating rule 1.1 - > Apps should not include content that is offensive, insensitive, upsetting, intended to disgust, in exceptionally poor taste, or just plain…

> intended to stimulate erotic rather than aesthetic or emotional feelings I suppose the key here lies in the last part ( emph. ), which is why most reader-apps are allowed, including GoT.

Even if the nudity and sex was deemed aesthetic content in apps is prohibited from having realistic violence, gore, rape, demeaning portrayals of any group, etc.

Re: Rethinking the App Store

#263

Post by notriddle »

saagarjha wrote: post #219
baddox wrote: post #210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most of them probably did, because it was generally difficult to jailbreak the phone and there wasn't much reason to do so unless you were a hobbyist. App piracy was definitely a thing though, and I bet there were some people who did it because a friend told them they can get free apps, only to end up installing stuff that made the phone very buggy (which was definitely easy to do). It's easy to say "well that's just…

Jailbreaking used to be as easy as going to a website and clicking "jailbreak".

I'm glad that doesn't work any more. I don't want arbitrary web pages to be able to run code as root on my phone.

Re: Rethinking the App Store

#264

Post by saagarjha »

notriddle wrote: post #263
saagarjha wrote: post #219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Jailbreaking used to be as easy as going to a website and clicking "jailbreak".

I'm glad that doesn't work any more. I don't want arbitrary web pages to be able to run code as root on my phone.

I'm glad too. But still, I don't think that has to mean "I can't run code as root on my phone".

Re: Rethinking the App Store

#265

Post by cglong »

nemothekid wrote: post #172
dkersten wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree with this. The only winners in the current situation are Apple. By opening it up to competitor app stores, yes competitors would benefit, but so would developers and so would their users. The App Store as it stands has completely stagnated to the point where it’s useless to me outside of actually downloading or buying an app. It’s been years since I’ve been able to discover new apps though it, now relying for…

> The only winners in the current situation are Apple. By opening it up to competitor app stores, yes competitors would benefit, but so would developers and so would their users. It's hard for me to reconcile this, and I keep seeing that 3rd party app stores would be better for users, but it all seems very handwavy. You would think this would be an easy point to prove as Android has had alternative app stores for yea…

One concrete example is Visual Studio App Center[1], which allows companies to distribute internal and beta apps to employees and invited testers. On Android, I can install the App Center app and then browse and install them exactly as I do with Google Play.

[1]: https://appcenter.ms/

Re: Rethinking the App Store

#266

Post by mistersquid »

supermatt wrote: post #13

I am of the opinion that the only fair option is to allow 3rd party stores with the same permissions as the official app store. Apples curation isn't (as they suggest) preventing malware, theft of information, etc - this if verifiably false given recent history with apps like tiktok stealing clipboard content. The ability to change content of payment screens post-approval (as epic have just done) also means that cura…

> Jobs originally said that the aim of the 30% was to cover costs of running the store. It is evident from the MASSIVE profits that this is no longer the case.

Steve Jobs no longer works at Apple.

Re: Rethinking the App Store

#267

Post by Tijdreiziger »

radley wrote: post #234
ryanbrunner wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's easy to just not use non-Apple app stores though. That's the current state of things on Google, where other app stores are allowed but the vast majority of people just use Google. If you personally value security and a smooth user experience over being able to install whatever you want go for it, no one would ever force you to use another app store.

> on Google, where other app stores are allowed but the vast majority of people just use Google... no one would ever force you to use another app store. Google implemented several hurdles to drive users away from competitive app stores. They're all but forcing people to use the Play Store.

How so? I can open my web browser right now and install F-Droid in a matter of a minute. I assume the same holds true for Amazon's app store.

Re: Rethinking the App Store

#268

Post by cglong »

threatofrain wrote: post #80
throwaway13337 wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can have your cake and eat it. Sandboxing-type security is damn good on mobile OSes. We tend to associate desktop with the insecure but it's not because of the lack of an app store. It's because desktop OSes do not sandbox, ask user permission, etc. Modern mobile OSes do so it's really night and day. This takes care of 90% of why mobile OSes are more secure than desktop ones - not app stores. I'm sure that there…

Apple's position is that if you want to deploy apps onto the iPhone, then you must provide a way for the user to signup with Apple as the intermediary. This actually increases user choices because for any app which has an existence outside the app store, users can now choose to either pay the conventional way or have Apple intermediate. Before users had to accept Microsoft's way or don't use Microsoft Office. I'm oka…

I would understand where you're coming from if Apple allowed apps to mention that other signup methods exist.

Re: Rethinking the App Store

#269

Post by cglong »

czzr wrote: post #37

One argument that I think deserves extra scrutiny is the idea that extra app stores can be “optional”. The reality is that developers would have a strong incentive to go to the most permissive App Store, and users will follow. Users will also underestimate or ignore risks. You can dismiss that by saying it’s the user’s responsibility, but I think that’s just an abdication of good systems design. I’m not saying that A…

For a few years, Amazon had an "Actually Free" campaign that let you play Android games for free with no ads as long as they were installed through Amazon's Appstore. Even that wasn't enough to dethrone Google Play :)

Re: Rethinking the App Store

#270

Post by Tijdreiziger »

joking wrote: post #27
supermatt wrote: post #13

I am of the opinion that the only fair option is to allow 3rd party stores with the same permissions as the official app store. Apples curation isn't (as they suggest) preventing malware, theft of information, etc - this if verifiably false given recent history with apps like tiktok stealing clipboard content. The ability to change content of payment screens post-approval (as epic have just done) also means that cura…

I'm on the same opinion, once the device is mine I should be able to install whatever I want. What would happen if I couldn't install the software I want on a desktop device? I really don't get how apple has survived so long with such a tight leash on IOS.

The desktop is incredibly outdated, and it's painfully visible. Any desktop application you install isn't sandboxed at all and has full access to all your files and peripherals (including camera and microphone). The only way to describe this is 'insane'.
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