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Some Dark Patterns Now Illegal in UK

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Re: Some Dark Patterns Now Illegal in UK

#251

Post by vidarh »

rmc wrote: post #195
idlewords wrote: post #8

A good example of beneficial government regulation, for people who refuse to believe such a thing exists. (Another good example is the Internet itself, but it's best to start small)

It's also a good example of good EU regulation. There are many in the UK who think the EU does nothing but regulate bendy bananas. The EU brings a lot of good law for the little guy to the UK (and other EU states)

Living in the UK, the thought of the UK potentially withdrawing from the EU is terrifying - so many of the complaints about the EU are about areas where the EU are interfering in absolutely awful attempts by UK politicians to restrict peoples rights.

It's even worse when they complain about things that are independent of the EU, but still blame the EU, such as which often happens with decisions from the European Court of Human Rights.

Re: Some Dark Patterns Now Illegal in UK

#252

Post by Vespasian »

mikestew wrote: post #103
Vespasian wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honestly I hope they will finally have to label them correctly. When I booked flights to Dublin recently, I felt being cheated on even though I checked everything twice and googled some. The insurance trick is among the worst practices I had to encounter personally. I'd prefer to have the official prices being hones even if they are somewhat higher. Their business model of offering only the minimal thing should work…

> When I booked flights to Dublin recently, I felt being cheated on even though I checked everything twice and googled some. Why on earth would you do business with a company that makes you " cheated"? RyanAir ran off all of the other airlines? They had the only flight to Dublin to see your poor, sick mother? Flights so cheap that you're willing to put up with the bullshit? It's an honest question, and I've heard som…

Yep the main reason here is them being cheap. I did travel with some people who really had to save up for this so cheap flight + cheap stay it was :)

Re: Some Dark Patterns Now Illegal in UK

#253

Post by [deleted] »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #117
Someone1234 wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then people are "increasingly" using it incorrectly. Europe is a continent, the EU is a political alliance. There are too many countries within Europe but not in the EU to use the terms synonymously. For example: Albania, Andorra, Belarus, Bosnia-Herzegovina, Croatia, Iceland, Liechtenstein, Macedonia, Moldova, Monaco, Montenegro, Norway, Russia, San Marino, Serbia, Switzerland, Turkey, Ukraine, Vatican City I think…

> Then people are "increasingly" using it incorrectly. Europe is a continent, the EU is a political alliance. Well, it's exactly the same as with America (the continent) and United States (a country). You can either argue that both calling EU Europe and USA America is wrong and we should stop, or accept that in both cases, people can figure things out from the context.

[deleted]

Re: Some Dark Patterns Now Illegal in UK

#254

Post by npsimons »

TeMPOraL wrote: post #117
Someone1234 wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then people are "increasingly" using it incorrectly. Europe is a continent, the EU is a political alliance. There are too many countries within Europe but not in the EU to use the terms synonymously. For example: Albania, Andorra, Belarus, Bosnia-Herzegovina, Croatia, Iceland, Liechtenstein, Macedonia, Moldova, Monaco, Montenegro, Norway, Russia, San Marino, Serbia, Switzerland, Turkey, Ukraine, Vatican City I think…

> Then people are "increasingly" using it incorrectly. Europe is a continent, the EU is a political alliance. Well, it's exactly the same as with America (the continent) and United States (a country). You can either argue that both calling EU Europe and USA America is wrong and we should stop, or accept that in both cases, people can figure things out from the context.

it's exactly the same as with America (the continent)

Where is this continent called "America"? I've never heard of it. I've heard of "North America" and "South America", but those are separate continents.

Re: Some Dark Patterns Now Illegal in UK

#255

Post by npsimons »

pdpi wrote: post #99
Someone1234 wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You misread the quote. They said "Europe" not the EU. So presumably they were hoping it would spread to non-EU European countries also.

I find that it's increasingly the case that "Europe" gets used in place of EU in much the same way as people will say "America" when they mean the USA.

as people will say "America" when they mean the USA.

Name another country with "America" in its name.

Re: Some Dark Patterns Now Illegal in UK

#257

Post by lilsunnybee »

dzhiurgis wrote: post #71
saosebastiao wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nobody can give you shipping charges without knowing your address. The credit card step exists because most of the time the billing address and shipping address are the same.

I've been their customer for ages, surely they could've worked it out.

It depends on what shipping address you use though. An online vendor could probably be sued for false advertising if they showed one shipping price, but then changed it later because a customer decided to use a new shipping address.

Re: Some Dark Patterns Now Illegal in UK

#258

Post by lilsunnybee »

TomGullen wrote: post #223
cessor wrote: post #38

I feel really bad about the fact that this is a thing. Apparently there are a lot of "entrepreneurs" that will always choose to annoy and damage others for a little currency. Why do these things have to be made illegal? They were immoral to begin with, that alone should stop people from doing it. Shame on you, people who sneak insurance into shopping carts and Ask-Toolbars into Java installers.

> Why do these things have to be made illegal? To stop people doing it.

You've missed the point, which was that it's lamentable such clearly immoral business practices have to be made illegal to keep people from engaging in them. Disallowing such practices brings benefit only because employees and business owners were being so unscrupulous to begin with.

Re: Some Dark Patterns Now Illegal in UK

#259

Post by npsimons »

npsimons wrote: post #255
pdpi wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find that it's increasingly the case that "Europe" gets used in place of EU in much the same way as people will say "America" when they mean the USA.

as people will say "America" when they mean the USA. Name another country with "America" in its name.

(Replying as edit window is gone)

So the whole reactionary "USA isn't America" thing seems a bit overblown and misguided at best; see for example http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/a_fine_whine...

And while jingoism, imperialism and US-centrism are good things to oppose, calling USA "America" isn't really an example of them. For one thing, by calling USA "America", you implicitly separate USA the country from the rest of the countries in North America and South America, and make the default assumption that the whole world isn't America. Point the second, if US citizens shouldn't be calling themselves "Americans", then neither should anyone else; at least "America" is in the name of the country for USA. Point the third, and I'm sure I'm not alone in this, but I've always assumed a kind of racism to go along with over-labeling; cf lumping Japanese and Chinese into the category "Asians".

As a final point, if we're really wanting to be more inclusive and eliminate borders and imperialism, shouldn't we all be calling ourselves "Earthicans"?

Re: Some Dark Patterns Now Illegal in UK

#260

Post by ZoFreX »

lorddoig wrote: post #211
ZoFreX wrote: post #169

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here's my Amazon challenge: Find a phone charger on Amazon that: * Isn't one of Amazon's own * Doesn't have a single review saying it caught fire or exploded Amazon is completely happy selling poor quality or even counterfeit goods, phone chargers are a particularly bad area of the site but others exist as well. There is no way Amazon could claim ignorance of this - there are 100s of reviews on some products such as…

Can you even begin to imagine what hell it would cause Amazon, at their scale, to be burdened with policing that? It would require a whole building full of Amazon compliance officers who won't always get it right - and when they don't they'd be liable which would cost more even more money and create ill feeling between Amazon and its customers as they'd be making assurances that they could not possibly keep (the stor…

What is the burden on every smaller shop that operates in this country and manages to obey these laws? Without Amazon's economies of scale, it costs them far more per item than it would Amazon. Just because the absolute cost to Amazon would be huge doesn't make it unfair as they have a lot more money total, in fact it's completely unfair that only smaller companies have to deal with this.

If it genuinely isn't possible for Amazon to sell chargers and obey the law, then they should stop selling chargers. No-one's making them do it.

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