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AWS says it can't restore some data from mideast facilities struck by Iran

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Re: AWS says it can't restore some data from mideast facilities struck by Iran

#251
post #43
post #3

They guaranteed 11 9's durability, didn't they? e: Yep https://aws.amazon.com/s3/storage-classes/

The SLA excludes force majeure.

Excluding war as force majeure in the Middle East is the same as excluding high tide as force majeure building a sandcastle at low tide.

Re: AWS says it can't restore some data from mideast facilities struck by Iran

#252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> genocide datacenters

[Palantir]( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palant%C3%ADr ) would like a word.

Moral condemnation has little coercive force unless it is backed by material power.

Re: AWS says it can't restore some data from mideast facilities struck by Iran

#253
post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is actually surprising to me. Claims like that are pretty common, they make sense and they should be true, so even though I don't really know AWS (/Backblaze/Azure/whatever) redundancy planning in enough detail, I used to trust them. It's really worrying when they outright say it will be ok, and then a week later it turns out to be not ok.

The devil is always in the details. Somehow I feel that when we offload the responsibility to some one else we get this feeling that the other person/entity would be doing full diligence and whatever else is required to carry out the job perfectly. However in reality most of the times they just do the bare minimum to pass your evaluation criteria to get the job.

This is almost always the case. It's one of the frustrating things about the software industry; because everything is much more complicated than the customer is able to comprehend, a software company can promise anything and the customer can't actually verify.

So any software company/project which actually took the time and effort to fully handle the enormous complexity, they can't sell themselves based on that fact because every other company (who didn't invest the effort) is also claiming it and the customer has no mechanism to verify the claims until some major rare event occurs.

And most of the effort is required precisely to handle those 1% of rare situations.

Re: AWS says it can't restore some data from mideast facilities struck by Iran

#254
post #237
post #230

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep, a lot of non-technical leaders believe that 'cloud' is synonymous with 'DR strategy' or even 'backup'. "We won't have to worry about being offline if our server goes down if we move to the cloud!" Some of these people fundamentally don't understand what the cloud is, their assumption is cloud means easy button that solves all your infrastructure and uptime problems.

You are pointing the fingers at the wrong people. Cloud providers pushed this idea onto executives via their marketing and conferencing channels. Not disimilar to how AI naratives are pushed on executives these last two years.

But alongside the marketing blitz they also offer certifications for people who are supposed to execute these projects. Even the most foundational certification exam -- which simply tests your recall on what AWS service is for compute versus networking -- teaches and tests you about "Shared Responsibility Model" that draws the line at what the customer is still responsible for when they use cloud bases IaaS / PaaS / SaaS services.

If businesses are going to cloud but without engaging / listening to competent people who know these basics -- then the blame needs to be somewhat pointed back at those very business leaders I feel.

This is not obscure magical knowledge either that is tightly controlled. Any cloud vendor will freely teach you that. Or even a google search would.

Re: AWS says it can't restore some data from mideast facilities struck by Iran

#255

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Backups in a different region?

Works unless local laws specifically block you doing that which they do for some classes of data in some countries. Multi-cloud in the same country (if that exists in the country and is far enough apart) maybe .

In this case, a local on-prem backup in your office-that-is-not-an-aws-datacenter would've worked and satisfy the law right?

(or an AWS Outpost thingy, assuming those things work even if the mothership is down)

Re: AWS says it can't restore some data from mideast facilities struck by Iran

#256
post #3

They guaranteed 11 9's durability, didn't they? e: Yep https://aws.amazon.com/s3/storage-classes/

Even if they have payable SLA on this, most SLAs have Acts of God and Acts of War exemption.

> US refuses payout for soldiers who died in Iran 'because it isn't a war'

> In response to another question, Mr Vance rejected using the word “war” to characterise US operations in Iran, saying there was “no active shooting”.

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=49596955

Re: AWS says it can't restore some data from mideast facilities struck by Iran

#257
post #73

This interview with an AWS leader isn’t aging well, from CBS Sunday morning: Pogue asked, "I don't mean to give anyone ideas, but let's say I figured out that one of these unmarked buildings was an AWS data center, and I blew it up. Are you saying that it's so backed up and redundant that you probably wouldn't notice?" Wood replied, "Yeah, you wouldn't notice. I mean, we might be a bit upset, but you wouldn't notice!…

[deleted]

Re: AWS says it can't restore some data from mideast facilities struck by Iran

#259
post #73

This interview with an AWS leader isn’t aging well, from CBS Sunday morning: Pogue asked, "I don't mean to give anyone ideas, but let's say I figured out that one of these unmarked buildings was an AWS data center, and I blew it up. Are you saying that it's so backed up and redundant that you probably wouldn't notice?" Wood replied, "Yeah, you wouldn't notice. I mean, we might be a bit upset, but you wouldn't notice!…

that quote is definitely making its way into a lawsuit

Yes. It's super hard to answer interviews or customer demos. Every sentence you say should include all preconditions that were said in previous answers, within the same context, because you may be quoted. You should think in live about all possible contexts in which your app might be used, and your speech should be as detailed as a contract.

Obviously here, he should have mentionned that they can recover a hit on a single data center, provided the customer chose multi-AZ hosting. That's probably why companies run their ads on "This watch is a legacy for your children" rather than any material claim.

Re: AWS says it can't restore some data from mideast facilities struck by Iran

#260
post #3

They guaranteed 11 9's durability, didn't they? e: Yep https://aws.amazon.com/s3/storage-classes/

It seems unreasonable to blame Amazon here. The AZ was destroyed. Are they supposed to have missile/drone defense? I'm not going to complain to DoorDash if my order is delayed due to a car crash

If a senior leader at Doordash swore to God that your sandwich would 100% guaranteed make it to you, regardless of whether or not there was a car crash, then yeah, maybe you should complain
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