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New Mac mini, featuring M6 and M5 Pro

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Re: New Mac mini, featuring M6 and M5 Pro

#251

So happy with my base M4 purchase for $499 when it released. I even snagged a 1TB replacement drive for $199 a year ago. Feels like I got the last train out.

I know it's at least a little irrational, but I am indescribably angry with the pricing trajectory of personal computing. I'm not all that young and for pretty much all my life the computers you as a random person could buy have consistently become massively more performant and massively cheaper over time. Even when the exponential performance increases started to taper off, every few years you could buy or build a new computer that was either cheaper or faster than the one you already had.

That trend of the last several decades has been completely destroyed in the last year or so. Sure you can buy a new computer that might be slightly better than one a few years old, but it will be significantly more expensive to the point where an upgrade is almost certainly not worth it unless money is no object. Even replacing a computer from the pre-AI era would be virtually impossible at anywhere near what it cost you to buy it new unless it was verging on truly ancient by computer standards. Computers have always been a counterpoint to inflation everywhere else, but now that seems to be not only no longer true, but computer costs are inflating significantly worse than other goods.

I find myself increasingly in favor of the movement against data centers. Not because I think data centers are bad on their own, but because of the hording of computing resources they represent and the impact that has on people trying to buy any sort of computing device for their personal use. The PC I built 2 years ago is basically irreplaceable at anywhere near the price I paid for it. That's a truly unacceptable state of affairs in personal computing.

Re: New Mac mini, featuring M6 and M5 Pro

#252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s not obvious to me. It’s somewhat surprising, even, given the specs I just looked up: M1 Max: 400 GB/s memory bandwidth, ~20.8 FP16 Tflops M4 Pro: 273 GB/s memory bandwidth ~17.2 FP16 Tflops

True but memory bandwidth is not the entire story. Geekbench (while not a end-all benchmark) shows: Single-Core Multi-Core M1 Max, 10-core 2,204 14,004 M4 Pro, 14-core 3,311 24,711 Single-threaded CPU: M4 Pro is roughly 1.5× as fast. Multi-threaded CPU: M4 Pro is roughly 1.75× as fast. GPU: roughly equal to a full 32-core M1 Max, with the M4 Pro slightly ahead in Geekbench Metal.

Makes sense. I am still getting a feel for the different levels of these processors.

Re: New Mac mini, featuring M6 and M5 Pro

#253
post #140
post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same thing for me! Got it with the education discount when it came out in 2024 and, although I've been pretty disappointed with macOS, it's crazy to see that the price increased by $300 in less than 2 years, with no sign of the price increases slowing down. What will happen once people are priced out of buying computers? I find this worrying.

I don't really understand this dooming. All market forecasters, memory bulk purchasers and the memory producers themselves have stated multiple times, unequivocally that the shortage will get worse in 2027 and then as new fabs come online the shortage will taper off as 2028 progresses. We've been through.. 4? 5? memory boom-bust-boom cycles already. Nothing is pointing to this one being any different, aside it probab…

I don't remember any previous price increase this significant or sustained. Relevant to this thread, I don't ever remember major computer companies like Apple having to significantly jack up their prices because hardware costs had gone up so significantly and stayed there.

Re: New Mac mini, featuring M6 and M5 Pro

#254
post #227
post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same thing for me! Got it with the education discount when it came out in 2024 and, although I've been pretty disappointed with macOS, it's crazy to see that the price increased by $300 in less than 2 years, with no sign of the price increases slowing down. What will happen once people are priced out of buying computers? I find this worrying.

> What will happen once people are priced out of buying computers? I find this worrying. What happens is that people start buying Chinese mini PCs, some of those even have spyware preinstalled along with another malware that is Windows 11

Chinese mini PCs are also affected: they're shipping with less RAM, at higher prices, or both.

Re: New Mac mini, featuring M6 and M5 Pro

#255
post #145
post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is APFS that much slower than ZFS or btrfs (more comparable Linux file systems) or just ext4? Btrfs is noticeably slower than ext4, but at least all the Mac and Linux file systems are way faster than file operations on Windows :)

Here's a very recent video benchmarking APFS vs ZFS, btrfs, and XFS+: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4wVNFaFDIn8

Just watched that after I got home from work. I was pleasantly surprised with how in-depth it was. Thanks for sharing it! It does seem like the worst issues he was seeing had to do with parallel IO performance, which is exacerbated by the agent development use case, so for sequential file creation/deletion, APFS is bad but not horrible.

Re: New Mac mini, featuring M6 and M5 Pro

#256
post #239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> it allows me to automate simple things like writing small patches or config changes in a matter of minutes where before I would have invested hours One of the problems here is that things like this only count as "increased productivity" in the economic sense if it results in more income at the end of the funnel. Are you actually making more product faster in all your new-found free time? Very few orgs I've worked i…

> One of the problems here is that things like this only count as "increased productivity" in the economic sense if it results in more income at the end of the funnel. Are you actually making more product faster in all your new-found free time? This strikes me as a problem with how we define productivity in this context. If I can do my job in 1 hour, when it took me 8 before, am I not more productive in a rate-based…

Wealth created is still the same, and that's what an economist means by "productive" - you produced X amount of wealth (usually measured in dollar amounts).

It's like "work" meaning one thing to a normal person, but something very specific and counterintuitive in Newtonian physics (if you carry a fifty-pound weight in a circle and stop at your starting point, you've done no work).

Re: New Mac mini, featuring M6 and M5 Pro

#257
post #115
post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mac Mini M4 launched less than 2 years ago at $600 (US, $500 with edu discount; as low as $400 on general discounts). Now same config with M6 is $900.

And except at the beginning, the Mac Minis of the past weren’t famous for being cheap, but rather for being disappointingly, unattractively expensive and, over time, apparently increasingly forgotten by Apple.

Mac minis from 2005-2024 launched with entry-level models priced from $499-$699, with the outliers being the 2018 model at $799:

https://everymac.com/global-mac-prices/all-msrp-mac-mini-pri...

Though $599 for the M4 in 2024 seems like a local optimum.

Re: New Mac mini, featuring M6 and M5 Pro

#258

So happy with my base M4 purchase for $499 when it released. I even snagged a 1TB replacement drive for $199 a year ago. Feels like I got the last train out.

I know it's at least a little irrational, but I am indescribably angry with the pricing trajectory of personal computing. I'm not all that young and for pretty much all my life the computers you as a random person could buy have consistently become massively more performant and massively cheaper over time. Even when the exponential performance increases started to taper off, every few years you could buy or build a n…

Isn’t this just inflation? We are in a highly inflationary environment. Everything is going up in nominal terms.

Re: New Mac mini, featuring M6 and M5 Pro

#259

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple does this thing where they pick a very old game and then boast about how well it runs. It's so bizarre. Not like Mac gaming is good anyway...they have "Game Porting Toolkit" but it's not free and open like Proton so nobody will use it unless Apple pushes them. Removing Rosetta doesn't help either.

Apple also just can't give up the idea of selling games through the AppStore either and you end up with situations like with AC: Shadows where it was ported, but you must buy the macport via the app store. Your copy on steam does not include the mac port, so if you wan to play on both your Windows/Linux desktop and Mac, you have to buy it twice. So stupid.

[deleted]

Re: New Mac mini, featuring M6 and M5 Pro

#260

I’m not really sure what the end goal is with Apple investing so heavily in local AI hardware. Feels like they’re doing it for the sake of getting with the times, but why would the average Mac User care? I wonder if this an answer the OpenClaw craze.

Running useful models locally with privacy would be a great selling point. We're not quite there, but the next five years should be interesting.
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