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Larry Ellison: "Citizens will be on their best behavior because we’re recording"

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Re: Larry Ellison: "Citizens will be on their best behavior because we’re recording"

#251

Post by lesostep »

lysium wrote: post #166
EastLondonCoder wrote: post #71

I think the really dangerous part here is not just “surveillance bad”. It is that AI removes the labour cost that used to limit surveillance. CCTV was already a problem, but someone still had to watch it, search it, interpret it, escalate it. AI changes that. It makes surveillance searchable, scalable and administratively useful. The shift is from “you may be observed” to “your behaviour can be continuously machine-i…

> Algorithmic decisions should have audit trails. I'm afraid it won’t help as much as we’d like. The algorithm might consider thousands of parameters all of which have scientifically been shown to correlate with some outcome. A famous example is a denied credit application where one parameter is the battery level of your mobile. A trail won’t help you decipher why the algorithm decided a particular action.

There was a post from a guy that looked up fraud transactions in db. And every query he used, he explained in a plain terms. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=48155212

If an algorithm can't be explained that way, I propose that it's a shit algorithm that shouldn't be used in production in places where its directly blocks people actions

Re: Larry Ellison: "Citizens will be on their best behavior because we’re recording"

#252

Post by sph »

justacrow wrote: post #196
sph wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Congrats to those among us building this dystopia. It's not Larry Ellison coding these systems.

Look, I have exactly two options: 1) Me and my entire family starves to death 2) I make 600k per year building surveillance systems for whoever wants them (as long as they're aligned with Peter Thiels and/or government interests)

I want to believe that you got downvoted by the Oracle employees making 600k a year, rather than by people that couldn't tell you were being sarcastic.

Re: Larry Ellison: "Citizens will be on their best behavior because we’re recording"

#253

Post by pnt12 »

shepherdjerred wrote: post #232
atmavatar wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I get a chuckle out of that quote like the rest of us, but what I don't like about the metaphor is that the lawnmower has no agency and thus bears no responsibility for the damage it causes, whereas Larry Ellison does.

Clearly you have already fallen into the trap

Both can be true:

It may not be worthy to question Oracle and Larry motives - it's money, at the cost of anything else (although his pro Israel stance may unveil some other ideology too).

But it's worthy to say they should be held accountable for the scrap they do. Unless we grow so cynical to think the system is deeply rotten and cannot be changed - which is a valid feeling to have given all ongoing events, but there's also some glimmers of hope here and there that are gaining traction.

Re: Larry Ellison: "Citizens will be on their best behavior because we’re recording"

#254

Post by kamaal »

hootz wrote: post #2

And of course, the best behavior will be the behavior that poses zero threat to the people in power. What a great future we have ahead of us, my colleagues.

Fear works only if delivered occasionally in byte sized quantities, too much of it and people not only stop fearing, they will also likely be indifferent to it, worse case even out right rebel.

If you had a weapon which is powerful, you better use it sparingly. Fear of the weapon is more important than the weapon itself.

Re: Larry Ellison: "Citizens will be on their best behavior because we’re recording"

#258

Post by myrmidon »

joquarky wrote: post #248
standardly wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I simply disagree. If I wanted an LLM's opinion, I would forego HN entirely and just use ChatGPT. I browse forums like this to get organic opinions from real people. When I see someone post an LLM reply, it makes me wonder - is the reply synonymous with their actual opinion, only formatted better? Or are they attempting to disguise an LLM output as something of their own? The former I am much more OK with, but the la…

>When I see someone post an LLM reply, it makes me wonder >but maybe we've reached a point of no return So you're creating your own suffering by perceiving a duality that doesn't really matter.

It clearly matters to him, and perception is not really a choice.

Personally, I've grown somewhat allergic to "AI-isms", and I'd rather not be (this example is still somewhat acceptable though). I also don't understand how we haven't trained this particular, obnoxious writing style out of them by now...

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