Brave: Brendan Eich's clean-ads browser startup • Hacker News Board

Re: Brave: Brendan Eich's clean-ads browser startup

#251

Post by teacup50 » Wed, Jan 20, 2016, 5:41 PM UTC

rorykoehler wrote: post #202

BrendanEich wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I get your point, and it is a good one. We have a micro payments channel to publishers, frictionless and anonymous, under construction, for folks who want no ads and who will pay. Other users than you will be able to mix and match, too: better and more private ads on sites they don't support, with a revenue share to these users that they can spend on sites they do. We aren't saying "only ads". We do see ads as a nece…

I fall into the camp of blocking all ads because frankly I don't like them. They are visual pollution. I also doubt I would pay for written content (maybe on a very rare occasion I might) if given a micro-payments solution because it doesn't seem worth paying for. I write blog posts from time to time and I do it for pleasure because I enjoy writing about things that interest me and sharing it with others. Honestly I…

Media got worse as the revenue streams dried up; if you pay for writing, you can expect much better writing.

I generally find that I'm better off spending an hour researching books to purchase on a non-programming subject than I am spending that hour Googling for free content on that subject.

Re: Brave: Brendan Eich's clean-ads browser startup

#252

Post by GFK_of_xmaspast » Wed, Jan 20, 2016, 5:41 PM UTC

reubenmorais wrote: post #100

sp332 wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mozilla is very protective of their trademark though. You're supposed to replace their branding with your own before distributing your modified code.

You're supposed to remove the branding from the binary — as in user visible logos and names —, not the source code. You can't reasonably expect forks to remove all the thousands of references to "Firefox" from the source code, like in comments, component names, etc.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sed

Re: Brave: Brendan Eich's clean-ads browser startup

#253

Post by davidw » Wed, Jan 20, 2016, 5:41 PM UTC

ellyagg wrote: post #190

RodericDay wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't emphasize this enough. Every time someone rattles out a list of "annoyances" regarding ads, I wish that I could plead with them to consider that there's even bigger reasons. Plenty of people try to sell the idea that ads let us have content "for free", and that all we have to tolerate is "a little annoyance". It's insane. If companies are buying ad-space, it's because they expect to get more business in retur…

It's not insane. I want to buy things, I'm going to continue to buy things, and advertisements sometimes make me aware of things I want to buy. If you think that's insane, I'm confused about why you're participating on a site that's fundamentally about promoting a culture of entrepreneurial spirit and enterprise, which requires making people aware of new products and services.

> I'm confused about why you're participating on a site that's fundamentally about promoting a culture of entrepreneurial spirit and enterprise, which requires making people aware of new products and services.

Because said site got popular, and diluted, would be my cynical guess. Your observation is spot on, though.

Re: Brave: Brendan Eich's clean-ads browser startup

#254

Post by devopsproject » Wed, Jan 20, 2016, 5:42 PM UTC

jagermo wrote: post #241

Playing the devils advocat: How Do you want to finance development in the lang run? It is a nice solution and I'd hate to see it go because of financial problems.

try reading the "about" section

Re: Brave: Brendan Eich's clean-ads browser startup

#255

Post by _pmf_ » Wed, Jan 20, 2016, 5:44 PM UTC

AdSense was considered the pinnacle of unobtrusive ads in the past.

Re: Brave: Brendan Eich's clean-ads browser startup

#256

Post by rorykoehler » Wed, Jan 20, 2016, 5:46 PM UTC

teacup50 wrote: post #251

rorykoehler wrote: post #202

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I fall into the camp of blocking all ads because frankly I don't like them. They are visual pollution. I also doubt I would pay for written content (maybe on a very rare occasion I might) if given a micro-payments solution because it doesn't seem worth paying for. I write blog posts from time to time and I do it for pleasure because I enjoy writing about things that interest me and sharing it with others. Honestly I…

Media got worse as the revenue streams dried up; if you pay for writing, you can expect much better writing. I generally find that I'm better off spending an hour researching books to purchase on a non-programming subject than I am spending that hour Googling for free content on that subject.

Sure, I buy books all the time. That is very different to the bubblegum content I read online which would fall under the micro-payments model though.

Re: Brave: Brendan Eich's clean-ads browser startup

#257

Post by mozumder » Wed, Jan 20, 2016, 5:46 PM UTC

jordigh wrote: post #70

I will repeat this one more time, because Eich seems to be missing the point.[1] I don't adblock for privacy, security, or speed. Those are just nice-side effects. I adblock because I do not want to be manipulated into buying things I do not need. I wonder what would happen if, as a society, we said, "enough, no more ads". Would it really be the capitalist apocalypse that the ad industry is trying to make us believe…

> I adblock because I do not want to be manipulated into buying things I do not need.

I don't understand this argument.

How are ads "manipulating" you? They're just ads. They're not an argumentative authority figure with a gun.

The only reason to block ads is because of speed of user experience. The "manipulation" argument is the weakest reason to block ads.

In any case, you manipulate other people for your own personal benefit. Everyone does.

Just talking to people is "manipulation".

Re: Brave: Brendan Eich's clean-ads browser startup

#258

Post by coldpie » Wed, Jan 20, 2016, 5:46 PM UTC

rmxt wrote: post #166

judah wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> "Why else would one oppose marriage equality?" There are many reasons why we oppose gay marriage, and none of them are because we have irrational fears of gay people. We have moral reasons, reasons due to time-honored traditions, societal reasons, child-rearing reasons, and more. See my post here: http://judahgabriel.blogspot.com/2015/07/torah-tuesdays-god-...

I don't imagine that grounding your pseudo-rational argument against gay marriage in religious texts will garner much traction here. There might be arguments from child-rearing benefits and social obligations...but using the Bible to justify those benefits seems like circular logic.

> There might be arguments from child-rearing benefits and social obligations

Since religious arguments trivially violate the 1st Amendment, these are the arguments that were tried in court and were found wanting. No need to rehash those cases here. The only remaining "argument" is an irrational fear or hatred of gay people, which we call homophobia.

Re: Brave: Brendan Eich's clean-ads browser startup

#259

Post by mozumder » Wed, Jan 20, 2016, 5:48 PM UTC

jordigh wrote: post #97

logingone wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't adblock for privacy, security, or speed. Those are just nice-side effects. I adblock because I do not want to be manipulated into buying things I do not need. Interesting. I'm the opposite. I've yet to encounter an ad that has a hope in hell of manipulating me at all. I couldn't be more dismissive of them. And if I encounter one too often my dislike of the company starts to grow. "It's show time, and you've b…

> I've yet to encounter an ad that has a hope in hell of manipulating me at all. If you know what "just do it", "the happiest place on Earth", "think different", or "the world's most advanced operating system" refer to, you've already been manipulated. A lot of ads are just about making sure you have a particular brand in mind and you're keenly aware of that brand's existence. Then, when time comes around to actually…

Yah, that's not "manipulation".

Re: Brave: Brendan Eich's clean-ads browser startup

#260

Post by quadrangle » Wed, Jan 20, 2016, 5:49 PM UTC

philh wrote: post #222

joosters wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course. You think for yourself. It's only other people that fall for advertising. It's amazing how many people think this is true.

All the data I have, is consistent with people having different levels of susceptibility to ads. It wouldn't surprise me if there are in fact people who aren't influenced by them. Do you have data which is inconsistent with this?

If lots of people are susceptible, I have to live in the world with the economy that this situation creates whether or not I'm personally as susceptible as someone else.