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ICE's Tool to Monitor Phones in Neighborhoods

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Re: ICE's Tool to Monitor Phones in Neighborhoods

#241

Post by suzdude »

stavros wrote: post #51
therobots927 wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

All it took was a white mother (and US citizen) getting shot in broad daylight. As much as I hate to admit it, a large enough segment of the population needed something blatant like this to care.

It's not flattering to the US that the mother who was murdered needed specifically to be white for people to care.

> It's not flattering to the US

There's such a long list of things one could say that about.

In this instance the "representation matters" thought process seems to bear out.

Folks talk about aspiring to role models who look like them. People also react strongly when this sort of thing happens to someone who looks like them.

Re: ICE's Tool to Monitor Phones in Neighborhoods

#242

Post by fsflover »

daheza wrote: post #22
icameron wrote: post #20

When I first heard the advice to ditch your phone when you go a protest, I thought maybe that's a little extreme. But it's a real threat. We already knew post Snowden there is an extensive big brother apparatus. We saw post 911 that all rights can be taken away in the name of counter-terrorism. Now with a government that's operating outside the law and labeling peaceful protesters as terrorists, I don't think we can…

If we all ditch our phones then how will we record the abuses of power?

Librem 5 phone has a hardware kill switch for the modem. The camera is not so great though.

Re: ICE's Tool to Monitor Phones in Neighborhoods

#244

Post by cheald »

I suppose I'm showing my age here, but Stingrays/IMSI-catchers have been around and in use for decades by both federal and local governments, and the problem of mass surveillance is not particularly an ICE problem. In my lifetime, the level of surveillance of the population has increased so dramatically that I'm not sure that younger people actually understand what it was like to live in a world where your every move wasn't monitored, recorded, and archived.

Privacy advocates have been fighting this battle for decades, but they have been utterly defeated because, by and large, people don't and can't be made to care about privacy until they learn the hard way (and when it's too late) why it's so important.

Re: ICE's Tool to Monitor Phones in Neighborhoods

#245

Post by iugtmkbdfil834 »

SpicyLemonZest wrote: post #235
iugtmkbdfil834 wrote: post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You see what you want to see, which is kinda revealing if you ask me. No. It is not enough. Reasonable person would be unlikely to find themselves in that position, which begs a simple question: What was her reason for being there? If you can answer that, we can start having a conversation. Until then, she is not some rando at the wrong place at the wrong time.

I fundamentally disagree that ICE deserves that presumption. They have repeatedly demonstrated themselves to be unreasonable people who want to hurt others. I'm sure there's a story they'll tell about why it was totally legal to shoot her, but they're murderers and you're supporting murderers until they prove that there was she was doing something so terrible they had no choice.

Hm, as with taxes, do we get to choose which federal enforcement agency we are willing to submit to? Not going to lie man, it is a fascinating frame of mind to me and I am absolutely willing to talk to you about it if you wanna go that route.

This is not exactly how any of it works, at all. I am not being difficult man, but I don't get to, say, block FBI caravan, because I don't think they deserve 'that' presumption ( quotation, because I am not certain what it refers to ).

I similarly don't get to tell DEA, ATF, and multiple other agencies to just fuck off, especially if I encounter them in the wild.. doubly so, if I was attempting to track them that day..

The real question then becomes:

Why do you think you get to pick and choose, who can enforce the laws of the land upon you?

More importantly, whose authority would you accept?

Re: ICE's Tool to Monitor Phones in Neighborhoods

#246

Post by GaryBluto »

eunoia wrote: post #210
GaryBluto wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I thought better of that quoted paragraph as it contained little substance and was just rude goading, which is ironically what you are doing.

How dare you quote me!

Why is it impossible for most people (more specifically Americans in my experience) to act in good faith during political discussion? You can't even admit wrongdoing or poor phrasing without them twisting your words or deliberately misunderstanding you.

Re: ICE's Tool to Monitor Phones in Neighborhoods

#247

Post by jacquesm »

kazinator wrote: post #238
jacquesm wrote: post #217

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, and that's usually directly traceable to who the phone was first sold to.

Or to the subscriber who last registered it to a network with a SIM, even though the SIM is not there now.

Typically that history is kept and it is kept for up to 20 years depending on which telco you look at. Those and the CDRs are gold for data mining and there are companies that specialize in doing just that.

It's insane if you think about it but the phone company knows as much or more about you than your mother or your spouse.

Re: ICE's Tool to Monitor Phones in Neighborhoods

#248

Post by phillipcarter »

RickJWagner wrote: post #224
thrance wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quite the opposite actually. Democrats have been so complacent with the proto-fascists for so long, that republicans will now justify murdering a mother in broad daylight, filmed under 3 angles clearly showing she is fearing for her life. The solution to fascism is not compromise and weakness.

We live in different worlds, friend. Please know there are people across the aisle that view it differently. When things calm down, talk with them and learn. Nobody wins when we insist the world is only as we alone view it.

Yeah, nah. No friendship here.

Re: ICE's Tool to Monitor Phones in Neighborhoods

#249

Post by baggy_trough »

embedding-shape wrote: post #229
lobf wrote: post #226

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, who else is using a pager in Lebanon? That's not a tool a normal consumer uses, it's only used by people to evade phone surveillance. I think it sounds like a high probability that anyone receiving one of these pages in Lebanon is part of Hezbollah.

> I mean, who else is using a pager in Lebanon? But they can impossibly actually know who physically has the pager next to them, when they're triggering them. This is the "failing to verify each target" part.

That's not a very realistic standard for a wartime covert operation.

Re: ICE's Tool to Monitor Phones in Neighborhoods

#250

Post by everforward »

chasd00 wrote: post #99
nemomarx wrote: post #5

Any tips on how to avoid this? I suppose those tin foil signal blockers might be useful?

Just leave your phone at home and bring a plain old small digital camera, agree ahead of time with friends on when and where to meet up. It's interesting to me and i guess showing my age that this isn't self evident to everyone everywhere.

I suspect the old school stuff is generally less monitored. I think some of the cheap Baofeng radios support AES256 encryption. I think that's technically only legal with a business license from the FCC or some such, but I'd be a lot less worried about an FCC fine than having my phone tracked. There's probably some quick keypresses to clear the encryption config so it looks like it was on plaintext.
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