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Apple employees criticize work-from-home policy in open letter

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Re: Apple employees criticize work-from-home policy in open letter

#241

Post by ianbutler »

CalRobert wrote: post #224
lolsal wrote: post #213

Can anyone honestly and sincerely tell me that online whiteboards are exactly equivalent to in-person whiteboard sessions? There is no value in having lunches together with your colleagues? There is no value in body-language when communicating? I'm all for fully WFH policies, but I think it's a bit naive or dishonest to say that it's exactly the same work experience. I've been working remote for over a decade and wil…

Your lunch break should be a break, not time you're forced to spend with your colleagues.

Most people are not forced to have lunch with their colleagues, a lot of people enjoy doing so however.

I always went out by myself when I wanted to eat alone, or sat at my desk with headphones in watching Youtube and eating.

You can communicate with people to help them understand you'd like your break to be a solitary one.

Re: Apple employees criticize work-from-home policy in open letter

#242

Post by randomsearch »

Apocryphon wrote: post #212
uberduper wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If only employers provided a space dedicated to working?

Correct, they can and should provide funds so that employees can rent out coworking spaces that are located near where they live, as opposed to commuting far to the physical office.

I like this idea. If I already have a home office, so I get paid this extra fund too? Or does my coworker only get it because he doesn’t have a home office?

Re: Apple employees criticize work-from-home policy in open letter

#243

Post by dehrmann »

tharne wrote: post #16

Stop whining and vote with your feet. If you're talented enough to work for Apple, there are plenty of other wonderful companies out there that will happily let you work remotely. Not every company needs to have the exact same policies on everything.

Also, you know Apple's stance. If they even respond to the open letter, expect that they'll want you back in a year or two, anyway.

Re: Apple employees criticize work-from-home policy in open letter

#244

Post by lolsal »

thrower123 wrote: post #226
lolsal wrote: post #213

Can anyone honestly and sincerely tell me that online whiteboards are exactly equivalent to in-person whiteboard sessions? There is no value in having lunches together with your colleagues? There is no value in body-language when communicating? I'm all for fully WFH policies, but I think it's a bit naive or dishonest to say that it's exactly the same work experience. I've been working remote for over a decade and wil…

Working remotely is better than all of those things, iff you commit to doing things correctly and writing things down. Doing things correctly would help if you were in the office too, but you can paper over the inefficiencies of doing things incorrectly by wasting more time on the backchannel communication face-to-face.

This sounds a bit like: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_true_Scotsman

Having lunch with colleagues has nothing to do with 'backchannel communication'. Sometimes it's nice to hear about where we like to go camping, or what cities are nice to visit in their home countries, or ... nothing to do with work or shipping products.

No matter how 'correctly' you think you're doing things, you still haven't convinced me after over a decade of shipping products that online whiteboards are useful, or refuted any of my other points.

Re: Apple employees criticize work-from-home policy in open letter

#245

Post by UnpossibleJim »

BaseballPhysics wrote: post #203
Eddy_Viscosity2 wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's entirely a byproduct of a lack of trust in management intentions. Absolutely true. Employees do not trust management for good reasons, because they have experience with management not being open and honest with them (speaking generally here, of course there are exceptions). Management's goals are often counter to those of the employees. Whereas workers want good pay, flexibility, work/life balance, and so on.…

> Management's goals are often counter to those of the employees. Whereas workers want good pay, flexibility, work/life balance, and so on. Management wants control, pay people less, have them work more, and so on. Many managers pretend they care about what the workers want, only to force on to them what they want. People pick up on that bait and switch after a few times. Again, speaking generally here, this isn't un…

You have to assume this type of bait and switch when companies like Apple, Microsoft and Google have spent so much money on their flagship campuses, that will have to be torn down and rebuilt as they were custom designed by architects in neomodernist styles as proxy corporate peens =/

Re: Apple employees criticize work-from-home policy in open letter

#246

Post by spiffytech »

CalRobert wrote: post #224
lolsal wrote: post #213

Can anyone honestly and sincerely tell me that online whiteboards are exactly equivalent to in-person whiteboard sessions? There is no value in having lunches together with your colleagues? There is no value in body-language when communicating? I'm all for fully WFH policies, but I think it's a bit naive or dishonest to say that it's exactly the same work experience. I've been working remote for over a decade and wil…

Your lunch break should be a break, not time you're forced to spend with your colleagues.

I fully agree, though this is highly team-specific. I've been on teams where I'm delighted to socialize with my coworkers for an hour most days, but I've also been on teams where I desperately needed 'me' time.

Re: Apple employees criticize work-from-home policy in open letter

#247

Post by shlurpy »

lolsal wrote: post #213

Can anyone honestly and sincerely tell me that online whiteboards are exactly equivalent to in-person whiteboard sessions? There is no value in having lunches together with your colleagues? There is no value in body-language when communicating? I'm all for fully WFH policies, but I think it's a bit naive or dishonest to say that it's exactly the same work experience. I've been working remote for over a decade and wil…

I think if commuting time was fully paid work hours, then companies would quickly agree that minor optimizations like this aren't worth it.

Re: Apple employees criticize work-from-home policy in open letter

#249

Post by vxNsr »

g42gregory wrote: post #227

Can somebody explain what “neuro-normative” is?

I always thought it meant like people without Asperger’s or other mental conditions. Which is odd bec many of us are on the spectrum, so who are they saying wouldn’t be hired?
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