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OnlyFans, influencers, and the politics of selling nudes during a pandemic

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Re: OnlyFans, influencers, and the politics of selling nudes during a pandemic

#241

Post by Fjolsvith »

GaryNumanVevo wrote: post #141
MuffinFlavored wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My question to most people on this forum are: would you really be ok if your daughter was best friends with a sex worker? Everybody says "of course!" in theory... but in reality I think it falls apart. Lots of blurred moral lines.

Any blurring of moral lines likely comes down to hangups W.R.T Body Autonomy. At the end of the day, if you one believes that everyone is allowed to make their own choices about their body, that would have to include their daughter, their spouse, their mother even.

And yet, we are not allowed freedom during a coronavirus lockdown.

Re: OnlyFans, influencers, and the politics of selling nudes during a pandemic

#242

Post by Fjolsvith »

Bedon292 wrote: post #85
GaryNumanVevo wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Clearly OP was linking selling photos of one's body to the moral failing. They make no mention of those systemic issues. "... they believe the only way of doing so is via selling pictures of their bodies - I think society has another massive moral failing on its hands" I don't agree that the moral failing is that people can earn money this way.

That is not how I read that, at all. My reading is that the moral failing is on society for not providing other options to them. Not that it is a moral issue for them to earn in that manner. If someone, who otherwise would not want to do this work, must because there are no other options to pay the bills it is an issue with society.

Seems to me that selling nudes is a pretty easy way to make a living, compared with other entrepreneurial types of businesses. Could it be that some of the outrage is due to the easy money?

Re: OnlyFans, influencers, and the politics of selling nudes during a pandemic

#243

Post by _8j50 »

commandlinefan wrote: post #233
yobin wrote: post #216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

False >Twin studies of adult individuals have found a heritability of IQ between 57% and 73% with the most recent studies showing heritability for IQ as high as 80% and 86%. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heritability_of_IQ

Even if it weren't hereditary (although I believe that it's well accepted and uncontroversial that it is), it's still pretty clear that it's innate. Even if intelligence is randomly distributed, I've never heard anybody suggest that intelligence isn't something you're just "born with" whether you got it from your parents or just got really lucky.

Well you just heard me say it. Your thinking capacity is limited and inherited but just like physical muscle devlopment, you can develop it. Women basically have to work out 10x men to have similar muscle development (hormones) but they can develop it. Similarly,you don't just grow muscle because your ancestors had a lot of muscle,you still have to work out. All that I have read about intelligence leads me to believe that while hereditary ceiling differences exist for certain "mental muscles", it is something you develop starting from early stages of life.

Re: OnlyFans, influencers, and the politics of selling nudes during a pandemic

#244

Post by Shared404 »

Fjolsvith wrote: post #241
GaryNumanVevo wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Any blurring of moral lines likely comes down to hangups W.R.T Body Autonomy. At the end of the day, if you one believes that everyone is allowed to make their own choices about their body, that would have to include their daughter, their spouse, their mother even.

And yet, we are not allowed freedom during a coronavirus lockdown.

As much as I would like to believe that Joe McRando is going to keep a six foot distance from me and where a mask, I've seen enough to make me believe he wouldn't.

Therefore, it stands to reason that it be, maybe not illegal, but definitely very heavily encouraged for people to stay home. It's one of the few cases where I am pro-government power (as much as it kills me inside to say).

Re: OnlyFans, influencers, and the politics of selling nudes during a pandemic

#245

Post by anigbrowl »

MuffinFlavored wrote: post #183
anigbrowl wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

basically all historically socially accepted conservative views If you need more than 3 qualifiers it's probably BS. You could just post why you think sex work is bad, but your numerous posts on this topic all seem to rely on invoking social sanctions or paranoia, ie making people feel bad about it without saying why you think they should. Seems kinda like your personal hangup.

I've got no personal hangups with the topic whatsoever. I think it is very fun to poke at the reality of what people online claim. Lots of trendy Miamians will claim it's empowering if somebody is a sex worker, then talk sh*t about them behind their back saying what a hoe they are. I'm trying to gauge the pulse of what HackerNews thinks.

Yeah yeah, every troll says they're 'conducting a social experiment'.

Re: OnlyFans, influencers, and the politics of selling nudes during a pandemic

#246

Post by generalpass »

smt88 wrote: post #235
rufus1 wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

more like economic insecurity combined with moral decrepitude. reduce everything to economic insecurity and you're not left with much

There is nothing inherently immoral about showing people your naked body.

It depends on the context, sort of similar to how there is "nothing inherently immoral about firing a gun."

If you are an adult, showing your naked body to a minor is considered in most western societies to be immoral.

Re: OnlyFans, influencers, and the politics of selling nudes during a pandemic

#247

Post by Fjolsvith »

Shared404 wrote: post #244
Fjolsvith wrote: post #241

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And yet, we are not allowed freedom during a coronavirus lockdown.

As much as I would like to believe that Joe McRando is going to keep a six foot distance from me and where a mask, I've seen enough to make me believe he wouldn't. Therefore, it stands to reason that it be, maybe not illegal, but definitely very heavily encouraged for people to stay home. It's one of the few cases where I am pro-government power (as much as it kills me inside to say).

When the government tries to prevent measures to limit this overreach (as in the LA mayor not allowing petitions to circulate for his recall) then I have to beg to differ.

Re: OnlyFans, influencers, and the politics of selling nudes during a pandemic

#248

Post by dang »

freefriedrice wrote: post #13
generalpass wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I observe this to be a narrative that many are pushing, but I don't see it anywhere IRL or even the proverbial data. I suspect they just fall out of statistics and into depression.

Narrative? Yes yes, because 99.9% of white christian american terrorists are women. /s Were you born today?

If you keep posting like this to HN we will have to ban you again.

If you wouldn't mind reviewing https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html and sticking to the rules when posting here, we'd be grateful.

Re: OnlyFans, influencers, and the politics of selling nudes during a pandemic

#249

Post by rland »

vharuck wrote: post #116
rland wrote: post #98

I watched this video recently about OnlyFans: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=djMojvschs0 It's more than just the content itself. "Becoming a fan" is a simulacra of a relationship, commodified. This already existed with escorts, of course, but never at this scale. My personality type is probably closer to being a "consumer" than being a "producer" of content on OF. I don't use the site. But if I did, my status as a c…

Things you're assuming: 1. Consumers use OnlyFans as a poor substitute to an in-person relationship. 2. It's always better to be in a romantic relationship than not. How is camgirling and pornography so different from other performance? What about comedians? They do the same thing as friends: tell jokes, laugh, entertain. A lot of them explicitly try to connect with the audience by asking questions and having short c…

Well, I'm not sure exactly what everyone uses OF for. I'm making the assumption that there is "something more" than just the pictures and videos, because I can search big boob on Google right now and get 2 billion hits.

The "something more" is the interaction -- recognition that you exist from the person you're tipping when you tip. Being a "follower" of an onlyfans girl to me seems much more about intimacy than about pornography.

I do think that in general close relationships, especially core intimate relationships like those with parents and spouses, are the most important things in human life. I guess that's my opinion but I find it hard to believe that anyone would disagree.

My argument really isn't about sexuality at all, because I don't think OF is about sexuality, really. Sex is a part of it but not the core of the platform. And it's not morality. I don't think it's morally wrong to do this, I do think it's depressing. That we feel so disconnected from one another that we are willing to forgo the "real thing" for a simulation.

I'm sure that for all of history there is some baseline level of the population that, for one reason or another, finds it so difficult to connect that they're not willing to enter a "real" relationship at all. What I worry about is if this portion of the population is growing, because there's a profit motive, or a psychological short circuit, or some disconnect caused by modern life.

It's hard to articulate exactly what, here. I just feel that there's something broken about OF or the world we've created that enables it to be so successful.

Re: OnlyFans, influencers, and the politics of selling nudes during a pandemic

#250

Post by blamestross »

ikeyany wrote: post #231
blamestross wrote: post #227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sex work is ok if the situation isn't coercive. A situation where the only reasonably available alternative choices are homelessness or starvation is coercive. Sex work is fine but a system that provides it as "last ditch employment" or as a means of survival in absence of alternatives is no different than rape. This applies to a lot more than sex work though :/

Are many of these women coerced into prostituting themselves? Do you have a similar moral problem with people doing other jobs out of desperation, like back breaking labor?

> Are many of these women coerced into prostituting themselves?

We lack studies on this in the US. I'd argue that most people who are involved in an illegal profession (in the US at least) often doing so for lack of viable alternatives.

In other countries where prostitution is legal and regulated, it seems is less likely to be a profession of last resort.

> Do you have a similar moral problem with people doing other jobs out of desperation, like back breaking labor?

Very much so.

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