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Apple changes default MacBook charging behavior to improve battery health

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Re: Apple changes default MacBook charging behavior to improve battery health

#241

Post by philwelch »

ratww wrote: post #56
wrs wrote: post #42

I've noticed that on newer (past few years) MacBook Pros, if their battery runs down too far they refuse to start up, even when plugged into the charger. The battery has to charge for 10-15 minutes with the "dead battery" icon on the screen. It's exactly the same behavior as iPhone/iPad. In past MacBook models, the battery could be dead--or even completely removed--and the charger would power the laptop fine. Anyone…

I've been explained that this is because those computers might need more power than the AC Charger is able to provide, so the battery is also used as a "backup" for burst loads. This [1] seems to confirm it. [1] https://web.archive.org/web/20081225111200/http://support.ap...

This probably goes hand in hand with the unremovable batteries. Back when they had removable batteries you could run it on AC with no battery installed and it would work fine.

Re: Apple changes default MacBook charging behavior to improve battery health

#242

Post by Polylactic_acid »

philwelch wrote: post #241
ratww wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been explained that this is because those computers might need more power than the AC Charger is able to provide, so the battery is also used as a "backup" for burst loads. This [1] seems to confirm it. [1] https://web.archive.org/web/20081225111200/http://support.ap...

This probably goes hand in hand with the unremovable batteries. Back when they had removable batteries you could run it on AC with no battery installed and it would work fine.

No, thats purely to prevent repair. Its perfectly possible to have a removable battery and to just not boot when one is not inserted. Thats how phones used to work ~2013

Re: Apple changes default MacBook charging behavior to improve battery health

#243

Post by p1necone »

diebeforei485 wrote: post #136

So many people on here seem to be intent on micromanaging their device's battery. IMO the whole point is to let macOS handle it so you can focus on actual work. I know Apple has screwed up in the past with throttling iPhone CPU's (bad). At this point they know not to go to those lengths again.

I don't understand why the iPhone CPU thing was such a big deal. It's a perfectly sane power management feature. Apple had to choose between two options:

A. Devices lose battery life per charge over time, eventually powering off randomly because not enough power can be supplied to run the hardware.

B. Devices throttle their CPU over time to keep battery life per charge relatively stable, and avoid powering off.

Apple chose B.

I also don't understand the people who are so upset that Apple didn't say anything - any hardware/software company will make thousands of little tradeoffs like this during R&D, they can't be expected to publicly announce every time they make a decision during development.

Re: Apple changes default MacBook charging behavior to improve battery health

#244

Post by speedgoose »

vpEfljFL wrote: post #140
rubber_duck wrote: post #53

I got a top spec 15 MBP a year ago and I have to say the experience is appalling - 4000$ device that goes full airplane takeoff levels of noise at any serious workload, no ability to control performance (I would gladly throttle the CPU sooner to avoid everyone in the office turning my way when I start an emulator or keep the fans at lower RPM but constantly instead of letting the CPU idle at 60-70 degrees with no fan…

Laptops isn't designed for serious workloads. It's a small portable devices to hash some errands at starbucks. You can't change physics laws unfortunately to make all the heat disappear somewhere. Keep in mind Intel marketing as well which advertises CPU with way less heat than they expose in real life. The way you have this machines is because apple is commercial company and they should follow market demands. "10 co…

They are not that slim nor very beautiful, but gaming laptops can handle serious workloads for a long time. And many of them have a feature to stay silent with lower performances. They actually have a much better cooling system, but it's heavier and more expensive.

Re: Apple changes default MacBook charging behavior to improve battery health

#245

Post by ddmma »

So the guys from sales enter in the engineering room and take some decisions on the way devices should behave, first months maximum usage and then degrade contantly until new releases to increase adoption. Oh my, was for your battery protection (no more juice) either was a bug (if privacy was jnvolved)

Re: Apple changes default MacBook charging behavior to improve battery health

#246

Post by askafriend »

Polylactic_acid wrote: post #186
askafriend wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That "issue" was way overblown. Apple's change did the right thing. It fixed a ton of older phones which before were rendered unusable since they would experience random shutdowns due to naturally degraded Li-Ion batteries. Every manufacturer should implement the kind of fix Apple did (and I'm sure at this point, they have). They even mentioned the change in the original release notes for the iOS update.

It wasn't the right thing. People thew out their phones because they were slow not knowing they could have been fixed cheaply with a new battery.

Apple has offered battery replacements for years before they rolled out that patch.

Replacing the battery would have fixed the issue at any time. It's not like they were holding it back.

Re: Apple changes default MacBook charging behavior to improve battery health

#247

Post by Polylactic_acid »

symmitchry wrote: post #190
cmckn wrote: post #80

Why doesn't the UI report 80% as 100%? It seems like exposing this to the user is more confusing than anything, when the cells could be over provisioned and treated politely by a system controller, without the user being part of the decision. Aren't SSD's over provisioned in this manner? You sell a drive with a terabyte of storage, but actually ship more than a terabyte of chips in the case to accommodate degradation…

Well, as a user, wouldn't it be nice if I could access 100 % of my battery for situations where I need as much life as possible? 20 % is fairly significant. It also cuts down on battery longevity, but plenty of people might not care at all.

Would be a fine feature if it was exposed in a setting for the user to pick.

Re: Apple changes default MacBook charging behavior to improve battery health

#248

Post by AlEinstein »

ddmma wrote: post #245

So the guys from sales enter in the engineering room and take some decisions on the way devices should behave, first months maximum usage and then degrade contantly until new releases to increase adoption. Oh my, was for your battery protection (no more juice) either was a bug (if privacy was jnvolved)

Did you even read the article? I’ve been wanting something like this for a while. It’s a solid engineering decision that needs good marketing to make sure people understand that it’s good for battery life.

Re: Apple changes default MacBook charging behavior to improve battery health

#249

Post by eecc »

rubber_duck wrote: post #83
eecc wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Just search for it https://www.eidac.de/

This is fan control - but I want CPU/GPU power control - I wouldn't mind lowering my boost clocks to limit peak temperatures on heavy workloads.

> or keep the fans at lower RPM but constantly instead of letting the CPU idle at 60-70 degrees with no fans

My reading skills still suggest SMCfanControl fulfills the description given by the parent post

Re: Apple changes default MacBook charging behavior to improve battery health

#250

Post by nodesocket »

hunter2_ wrote: post #195
nodesocket wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I keep my MacBook Pro 16" plugged in 80% of the time, but when I want to go work at a coffee shop on battery having 50% would be a big inconvenience. How much longer in terms of battery life are we talking doing 50% charge vs 100%?

You would remove the 50% charge limit prior to undocking so that it's at 100% right on time. Calendar integration could easily automate the limit-removal time (maybe 30min before you have to leave, or whatever is needed).

I think you are vastly underestimating my spontaneous and lazy nature.
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