Live data from Hacker News

Microsoft May Have Created the Slowest Windows in 25 Years with Windows 11

eteknix.com

231–240 of 390 posts

Re: Microsoft May Have Created the Slowest Windows in 25 Years with Windows 11

#231
post #222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

macOS has Cocoa since 2000, which is still useable, and SwiftUI since a few years. No comparison to the mess of UI toolkits on Windows.

I suggest paying attention to some mac development podcasts.

What would I learn there?

Re: Microsoft May Have Created the Slowest Windows in 25 Years with Windows 11

#232
post #36

I liked the path windows was going in late 2010s. WSL, power toys, many great utils, great performance. But it has since then stalled and got increasingly worse. Especially with this AI shoving everywhere, not even mentioning getting ads at some point in notifications and start menu. I'm not particularly in love with MacOS either (but have no realistic alternative on my MacBooks). I'm more and more inclined of switch…

Even without the AI, it's replacing native apps with web based ones. Case in point: Notepad. It's slower than WordPad on Win 10... and crashes!

What does notepad have to do with web based apps? case in what point?

New Notepad in 11, with tabs and autosave (and dark mode), is so much better and more practical to use over old one, it just stays open all the time and become my main notetaking pick. It may take a beat to open a big file (1+ mb) with line wrapping, but it's pretty much just as fast as anything (and may be even faster than some other editors). It's just very easy to reach for and quite snappy.

There are some apps on Windows with actual gripes, but Notepad, Paint, Snipping tool, they're quite solid and have become everyday tools that eliminated the need to reach for some other third party apps.

Re: Microsoft May Have Created the Slowest Windows in 25 Years with Windows 11

#233

May not have been a fair test. Windows is running the kernel in a kinda VM which older computers have not been optimized for -- newer generations of CPU can smooth out the overhead. For a fair test against Windows 10 and below, you'll have at least to do this: "Temporarily turn off your Memory Integrity and VMP" -- https://support.microsoft.com/en-US Also, it's important to have all bits and pieces of Hyper-V/Windows…

You’re advocating for a flawed test.

Why is it, when ever someone points out that Microsoft shits the bed on something someone will come out with ludicrous ideas about changing the default environment.

The default environment is what you get, all this handwringing about whats potentially possible misses the point entirely; for decades we have, as a community, scoffed at linux for requiring you to understand deeply how your OS works in order for it to function. Now we’re in the situation where the out-of-the-box experience for gaming requires less esoteric knowledge on Linux than Windows, yet people defend Windows still.

Do you seriously think the exec running emails even knows what Hyper-V is? Do you think any IT department is going to disable memory integrity?

Would any Dev disable WSL? Do the vast majority of gamers want to do this? Should they have to?

You’re now arguing that overhead is ok because its mitigated by newer hardware, I don’t believe that to be true as I run W11 on A Threadripper 3970x and an i9-14900k and the fuckers feel leagues slower than my M1 Macbook, its a joke! Like 10x the power/thermal envelope- and sure, some of that is down to the M1 being great, but there’s no benchmark putting it above those CPUs.

Stop pretending that this is ok, and stop trying to spread uncertainty about a valid test.

I’d prefer newer hardware too, but this is the compromise if we want older OS’s to be included.

Re: Microsoft May Have Created the Slowest Windows in 25 Years with Windows 11

#235

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is awful in many ways. Among other things what really gets my goat is that Xbox something or other ads can have cartoony sexuality, violence, and so on. Those things don’t bother me, but there are plenty of elderly, conservative, religious, etc. people who would be taken aback by it. There’s plenty of that content in our media, but those people don’t consume that media. A computer is a critical general purpose t…

Link to this fridge? Just so I know which one to avoid you know

Probably a Samsung, the company that replaced door handles with a microphone for "open fridge" voice command, and advertises to you based on the contents of your fridge.

Re: Microsoft May Have Created the Slowest Windows in 25 Years with Windows 11

#236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I ran it on an 2005 computer in 2005. And I remember it was very slow. Win7 was good then, 3 years later.

Incredible you could run it in 2005 since it was released in late 2006. I ran windows vista beta that summer on my new 2GB computer, it was a great OS in my view.

Sorry, then it was 2006. Thanks for pointing that out. You know my brain is getting older...

Re: Microsoft May Have Created the Slowest Windows in 25 Years with Windows 11

#237

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've been pretty much exclusively Linux-based for over a decade now, but I used every version of Windows from 3.11 to Windows 7, so I still have some muscle memory from the good ol' days. Recently I was helping a relative do something on their Windows 11 machine and I asked them to press Windows key + R, type calc, press Enter. And I was astonished at the result. Literally: Mouth agape, frozen in astonishment for abo…

What does happen? I'm using Windows 10 Enterprise (is that GitHub repo to activate any license still around?) , with policy to disable Internet search from the start menu... so your story makes me wonder what the astonishment is.

I'm betting a very large loading time.

Re: Microsoft May Have Created the Slowest Windows in 25 Years with Windows 11

#238

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you expand on this? For example details on any tools to do this. I've been trying to disable features I know use resources and aren't needed but the native UIs to do it are hella confusing and feel purposely useless.

Google "windows 11 debloat reddit". There are several tools: - https://github.com/Raphire/Win11Debloat (recommended elsewhere in this thread) - https://christitus.com/windows-tool/ (I used this one a couple weeks ago, seems to work well) But seriously though, learn to fish. The answers aren't hard to find if you look, know what to search for, and are at least somewhat discriminating in your investigation.

The Chris Titus utility has worked very well for me. I used it to de-bloat Win 11 after I upgraded the OS last year.

I run Win 11 on an old tiny NUC PC that has Windows 10 before - now it does seem faster, is very stable and is not so annoying.

One thing: AFAIK you need to have the Windows 11 Pro version for the best de-bloating results.

Re: Microsoft May Have Created the Slowest Windows in 25 Years with Windows 11

#239
post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It sounds weird to say, but Steve Ballmer was probably the best CEO of Microsoft.

Or: Steve Ballmer oversaw the decline of Mircosoft's flagship product, but left before he could be blamed for it. A lot of Windows' current problems can be traced back to the Ballmer era, including the framework schizophrenia, as Microsoft shifted between Win32, UWP, WPF, and god knows what else. This has lead to the current chaotic and disjointed UI experience, and served to confuse and drive away developers. Repeat…

I think MS's biggest mistake was to not properly maintain and develop the Foundation Classes, basically a thin C++ wrapper library on top of the C API that retained most of the benefits of the Win32 API while eliminating a lot of the boilerplate code. Instead they went after Java with the .NET managed stuff, bloated and slow compared to the native API.

Qt is now the best "old school" UI framework by far.

Re: Microsoft May Have Created the Slowest Windows in 25 Years with Windows 11

#240

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Microsoft has the resources to train people.

But does any junior want to learn C++ Win32? You want to learn something that leads to a long-term career development path, not a sunsetting technology.

> But does any junior want to learn C++ Win32?

That's why they got the job, didn't they ? /s

Post reply on HN