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The Vietnam government has banned rooted phones from using any banking app

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Re: The Vietnam government has banned rooted phones from using any banking app

#231
post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd be really interested to know whether a significant amount of fraud and fraud attempts involve devices with root or non-stock operating systems. This has always struck me as a matter of checkbox compliance rather than a commonly-exploited attack vector, though I'll grant that's partially because few people actually use such devices.

Intuitively I'd say no, there's no way it's a significant amount of fraud. Number one because, as you said, it's rare, but number two because you just don't need a rooted phone to scam someone. You can very easily scam people on perfectly legitimate phones and with perfectly legitimate apps.

Keyloggers would be considered a form of fraud, right? Customers can be protected by not allowing rooted phones which may contain malware and steal credentials, but then again Windows is a nightmare for security and nobody is banning banking from Windows.

Re: The Vietnam government has banned rooted phones from using any banking app

#232
post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There won't be a reasonable way to bypass it as it requires a Google authenticated manufacturer to leak the keys or an TEE exploit. All public key boxes are banned and Google regularly bans new ones . That endpoint contains the list of revoked keyboxes : https://android.googleapis.com/attestation/status

I'm not a security researcher, but I do believe in the ingenuity of others. If all else fails, this kind of law in my own country would lead me to running apps within a virtualised environment (if possible), or a dedicated cheap device in a drawer with my actual device still being mine.

This kind of checks would prevent you from running the app in virtualized environments too. You'll need the cheap device, assuming it doesn't get too old or its keys get leaked and your device also gets distrusted as a consequence.

Re: The Vietnam government has banned rooted phones from using any banking app

#233

So, if you cannot cryptographically prove to a remote server that your device is running essentially unmodified, vendor-signed software, you are locked out of the economy? The irrefutable part here is that the security model works. Locking down the bootloader and enforcing TEE signatures does stop malware. But it also kills user agency. We are moving to a model where the user is considered the adversary on their own…

As I mentioned in another post: By 2026, you'll need two phones. My current setup: 1) An unmodified iPhone SE (2022 model) with OS support until 2032. This runs all my authentication, banking, health, etc. It is in airplane mode 99% of the time unless I need it. 2) The second is a Pixel 9a with Graphene OS for daily use, routing and internet access. This is expensive, but I found it to be the only viable solution to…

I do something similar but it's iPhone SE plus olympus camera plus laptop. The laptop is where all the libre software lives, and the camera is (of course) for taking pictures with. I don't use the phone for anything except boring essentials, for the most part.

Re: The Vietnam government has banned rooted phones from using any banking app

#234
post #190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As I mentioned in another post: By 2026, you'll need two phones. My current setup: 1) An unmodified iPhone SE (2022 model) with OS support until 2032. This runs all my authentication, banking, health, etc. It is in airplane mode 99% of the time unless I need it. 2) The second is a Pixel 9a with Graphene OS for daily use, routing and internet access. This is expensive, but I found it to be the only viable solution to…

>An unmodified iPhone SE (2022 model) with OS support until 2032 What makes you think it'll be supported for a decade? Looking at the past models, the support period is around 5-7 years. If you count security updates that might get you to 10 years, but at the 7-9 year mark apps will eventually refuse to update because you're not on the latest ios. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IPhone#Models

If you’re not using it regularly, why would you need anything except security updates?

Re: The Vietnam government has banned rooted phones from using any banking app

#235
post #200
post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not if you want to use tap-to-pay systems.

I wonder if this makes room in the market for some simpler device for payments. Something like a wearable that you can tap-to-pay and has the signed software attenuation but nothing else so you can't be tracked using GPS.

> Something like a wearable that you can tap-to-pay and has the signed software attenuation but nothing else so you can't be tracked using GPS.

That's a nice idea. You could have a simple card-shaped device with no screen or buttons, and call that a "credit card".

Re: The Vietnam government has banned rooted phones from using any banking app

#236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As I mentioned in another post: By 2026, you'll need two phones. My current setup: 1) An unmodified iPhone SE (2022 model) with OS support until 2032. This runs all my authentication, banking, health, etc. It is in airplane mode 99% of the time unless I need it. 2) The second is a Pixel 9a with Graphene OS for daily use, routing and internet access. This is expensive, but I found it to be the only viable solution to…

With all due respect - I totally understand you may need a rooted phone, I’m just curious what you use it for? I’ve never had a modified or rooted phone so I don’t know of any of the reasons you might need one.

System wide adblocking, being able to backup any app are the top two reasons I'd still root my phones if i had any choice. You'd be amazed by the battery life improvement you'd get by just blocking ads..

I deliberately avoid all banking apps even though i didn't root my phone, but i have to use Google Pay a lot. So... That's the only reason this phone I'm typing on isn't rooted.

Re: The Vietnam government has banned rooted phones from using any banking app

#237

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's a mobile deposit and why do you need an app to check it?

It's the ability to take a picture of a check and deposit it into your account that way, vs having to take the check to an actual branch of a bank. Here in the US, I still get checks frequently enough that it's nice to have.

I'll bet the confusion stems from the rest of the world having essentially forgotten what is a check/cheque almost a generation ago.

I only used them twice in my life, last one was in 2012 and I had to get a supervisor at the bank to find the procedure to get a checkbook at the time.

Re: The Vietnam government has banned rooted phones from using any banking app

#238
post #200
post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not if you want to use tap-to-pay systems.

I wonder if this makes room in the market for some simpler device for payments. Something like a wearable that you can tap-to-pay and has the signed software attenuation but nothing else so you can't be tracked using GPS.

Sounds like... a card?

Re: The Vietnam government has banned rooted phones from using any banking app

#239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As I mentioned in another post: By 2026, you'll need two phones. My current setup: 1) An unmodified iPhone SE (2022 model) with OS support until 2032. This runs all my authentication, banking, health, etc. It is in airplane mode 99% of the time unless I need it. 2) The second is a Pixel 9a with Graphene OS for daily use, routing and internet access. This is expensive, but I found it to be the only viable solution to…

With all due respect - I totally understand you may need a rooted phone, I’m just curious what you use it for? I’ve never had a modified or rooted phone so I don’t know of any of the reasons you might need one.

I want to backup my entire phone on a local server I own. Apps, app data, settings, WiFi passwords, call logs, etc. Good luck without root.

Re: The Vietnam government has banned rooted phones from using any banking app

#240
post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Recalling Venmo winding down web beginning in… let’s see… 2018! https://www.digitaltrends.com/phones/venmo-shutters-web-plat...

Why do people need these crappy fintech apps at all? Can you not give your friends cash or send a wire?

In the US, in my experience, young people don't want to deal with cash at all. Older people do, but it's not always convenient to meet up.

Most banks charge a fee for sending a wire. Sending an ACH is free, but most restrict that to your own account. Revolut is the only one I've seen that lets you just spam ACH to anyone. In both cases, it isn't instant.

Zelle largely fixes those issues, but has its own issues, like a lot of banks not supporting it and/or arbitrarily low send limits.

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