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The Vietnam government has banned rooted phones from using any banking app

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Re: The Vietnam government has banned rooted phones from using any banking app

#181

Post by itsamario »

Helmut10001 wrote: post #106
Fiveplus wrote: post #82

So, if you cannot cryptographically prove to a remote server that your device is running essentially unmodified, vendor-signed software, you are locked out of the economy? The irrefutable part here is that the security model works. Locking down the bootloader and enforcing TEE signatures does stop malware. But it also kills user agency. We are moving to a model where the user is considered the adversary on their own…

As I mentioned in another post: By 2026, you'll need two phones. My current setup: 1) An unmodified iPhone SE (2022 model) with OS support until 2032. This runs all my authentication, banking, health, etc. It is in airplane mode 99% of the time unless I need it. 2) The second is a Pixel 9a with Graphene OS for daily use, routing and internet access. This is expensive, but I found it to be the only viable solution to…

Phones are cheap, serivce isn't. If currency goes fully digital, not having two devices is irresponsible.

Re: The Vietnam government has banned rooted phones from using any banking app

#182

Post by redeeman »

OutOfHere wrote: post #111

Why can't rooted phones pretend to be non-rooted phones for the purpose of certain apps? What's the point of rooting if you can't even selectively pretend?

they can to a large degree. but theres many layers to it. I for example hide root from my banking app in Portugal.

Re: The Vietnam government has banned rooted phones from using any banking app

#184

Post by unethical_ban »

Fiveplus wrote: post #82

So, if you cannot cryptographically prove to a remote server that your device is running essentially unmodified, vendor-signed software, you are locked out of the economy? The irrefutable part here is that the security model works. Locking down the bootloader and enforcing TEE signatures does stop malware. But it also kills user agency. We are moving to a model where the user is considered the adversary on their own…

Does it? Are you telling me banking apps have no choice but to go to this extreme when none of my seven US financial institutions even implement TOTP?

This is lazy control.

Re: The Vietnam government has banned rooted phones from using any banking app

#185

Post by layer8 »

fph wrote: post #166
finaard wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess you can still do banking on your PC? I stopped using banking apps on my phones a few years ago - they got more and more annoying, and I don't buy into the "the device is secure and should be used as a trust token". So I'm now back to banking only on my computer, with a hardware token for TAN generation.

Hardware tokens are not allowed in Europe to authorize certain operations such as bank transfers: you need a device that can show the operation you are about to authorize ("enter 123456 to confirm your payment of 99.99 € to Pornhub"). And that essentially means using a phone.

Maybe it’s country-specific, but most banks I know support a card reader or photoTAN device. You don’t need to use a phone.

Re: The Vietnam government has banned rooted phones from using any banking app

#186

Post by alephnerd »

bsimpson wrote: post #18
taosx wrote: post #5

I really don't understand this. My line of thinking is that if someone is technical enough to root his phone he understands the risks. Why would they force banking apps to detect and not work on rooted phones? Why would the government care so much?

Vietnam is a one party state. Does the government control the banks?

Somewhat. The most popular banks are SOEs owned by ministries, but private sector banks that are local (eg. SCB) or foriegn like Shinhan or HSBC, along with private sector fintech is booming.

Re: The Vietnam government has banned rooted phones from using any banking app

#187

Post by derefr »

zozbot234 wrote: post #122
Helmut10001 wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As I mentioned in another post: By 2026, you'll need two phones. My current setup: 1) An unmodified iPhone SE (2022 model) with OS support until 2032. This runs all my authentication, banking, health, etc. It is in airplane mode 99% of the time unless I need it. 2) The second is a Pixel 9a with Graphene OS for daily use, routing and internet access. This is expensive, but I found it to be the only viable solution to…

This is a sensible move. Plus you can just keep your "authentication" phone at home instead of having it on you when you're out for no good reason.

Not if you want to use tap-to-pay systems.

Re: The Vietnam government has banned rooted phones from using any banking app

#188

Post by NoMoreNicksLeft »

immibis wrote: post #68
SketchySeaBeast wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't like that. I'm of the "if you're going to do something important, do it on your PC" generation. I do not want a future where I lose my phone and I can no longer access my bank.

Claim you don't have a phone, and they'll find a solution.

Unless you are a multimillionaire, they will tell you to go do business elsewhere, you're not worth their trouble.

Re: The Vietnam government has banned rooted phones from using any banking app

#189

Post by mschuster91 »

add-sub-mul-div wrote: post #117
Fiveplus wrote: post #82

So, if you cannot cryptographically prove to a remote server that your device is running essentially unmodified, vendor-signed software, you are locked out of the economy? The irrefutable part here is that the security model works. Locking down the bootloader and enforcing TEE signatures does stop malware. But it also kills user agency. We are moving to a model where the user is considered the adversary on their own…

> you are locked out of the economy? Not that it excuses the withdrawal of user agency. But I've never used a banking app on my phone before. Anything important I still like to do on a desktop. Though how much longer that's safe, who knows. Apple's model of requiring their permission to run code on your own device will probably spread to everything given enough time.

> But I've never used a banking app on my phone before.

Here in Europe, good luck using any form of online payment without one due to 2FA requirements.

Re: The Vietnam government has banned rooted phones from using any banking app

#190

Post by gruez »

Helmut10001 wrote: post #106
Fiveplus wrote: post #82

So, if you cannot cryptographically prove to a remote server that your device is running essentially unmodified, vendor-signed software, you are locked out of the economy? The irrefutable part here is that the security model works. Locking down the bootloader and enforcing TEE signatures does stop malware. But it also kills user agency. We are moving to a model where the user is considered the adversary on their own…

As I mentioned in another post: By 2026, you'll need two phones. My current setup: 1) An unmodified iPhone SE (2022 model) with OS support until 2032. This runs all my authentication, banking, health, etc. It is in airplane mode 99% of the time unless I need it. 2) The second is a Pixel 9a with Graphene OS for daily use, routing and internet access. This is expensive, but I found it to be the only viable solution to…

>An unmodified iPhone SE (2022 model) with OS support until 2032

What makes you think it'll be supported for a decade? Looking at the past models, the support period is around 5-7 years. If you count security updates that might get you to 10 years, but at the 7-9 year mark apps will eventually refuse to update because you're not on the latest ios.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IPhone#Models

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