My stages of learning to be a socially normal person • Hacker News Board

Re: My stages of learning to be a socially normal person

#231

Post by cindyllm » Tue, Nov 18, 2025, 5:01 AM UTC

Nathanba wrote: post #175

AuthAuth wrote: post #28

This sounds like a ton of work to learn and by the end it sounds more like a curse than a super power. To be so above people in terms of social intelligence must be horrible. It sounds like the Author views interactions on a completely different level. I dont have any offensive social strategy so its hard for me to dictate making friends but passively I do quite well by just projecting an authentic version of myself.

I've always hated it when people juggle me and when I notice that I'm getting played. "Normal" people seem to absorb this strategy subconsciously throughout their lives and train themselves to do it too because they notice that it works better. To someone who notices this consciously it seems psychotic because well of course it's always easier to cheat, lie and fake your way to an advantage. You should be choosing no…

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Re: My stages of learning to be a socially normal person

#232

Post by underlipton » Tue, Nov 18, 2025, 5:04 AM UTC

1shooner wrote: post #219

etangent wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> a lot of the points felt more like learning how to charm, manipulate, and game social interactions. A lot of stuff "normal" people do is charm, manipulate, and game social interactions. Except because they are not conscious about it, we give them a pass. One of the characteristics of autistic-spectrum individuals is that they must make a conscious effort to achieve goals that are achieved unconsciously by most of u…

>A lot of stuff "normal" people do is charm, manipulate, and game social interactions. Except because they are not conscious about it, we give them a pass. One of the characteristics of autistic-spectrum individuals is that they must make a conscious effort to achieve goals that are achieved unconsciously by most of us. I have to say this strikes me as a very distorted perception. I don't know about 'normal,' but a s…

>they had the capacity to learn from interacting with others

Or, were allowed to learn it from others.

>and had the confidence to iterate

Or, the safety to iterate.

This seems to be just shifting where socially-successful people received uncommon benefit-of-the-doubt.

Re: My stages of learning to be a socially normal person

#233

Post by gblargg » Tue, Nov 18, 2025, 5:07 AM UTC

somenameforme wrote: post #221

scandox wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is a mistake I think. Many 'normal' people who grow up (emotionally) make a conscious effort not to instrumentalize their social interactions even if they do know how to do it. Certainly with friends they aim to be authentic. I think emulating things that a serious person discards is a step backwards.

I wouldn't say just friends either. The biggest leap I made in social stuff is to simply stop caring what other people think. If somebody doesn't like me, cool - there's plenty of other people. If they do? Awesome, because they're getting the 'real' me, so it's probably going to be a good relationship. Basically I think a lot of people's issues with social stuff starts with something analogous to a boy who never asks…

> The biggest leap I made in social stuff is to simply stop caring what other people think.

If you do care what other think, you alter your behavior to make them think what you prefer, and it becomes inauthentic on your part and manipulation of others. That's not to say that all things for others are manipulation; if you find out that you don't listen to people well and improve that, they might like being around you more because being heard is an important core part of relating.

Re: My stages of learning to be a socially normal person

#234

Post by bbminner » Tue, Nov 18, 2025, 5:11 AM UTC

Nimitz14 wrote: post #205

bbminner wrote: post #21

I have been trying to manage other people's feelings and reactions for as long as i can remember. That's a self-soothing fantasy of sorts. With this mindset, you are naturally drawn to people who need such emotional management - a realization that you can't actually manage other people's happiness was long and painful. These days I am not sure that getting people to open up by altering your presentation is a good ide…

I think you're bang on the money fwiw. But also worth mentioning that it's OK to ask rather than trying to predict and feeling that having to ask means failure

But the same applies to the person you are talking to - it is their job to reach out to you if they need help. It is not your job to prove anything to them by reaching out when (your heightened vigilance picks up that) something is off.

I am never buying the story of "i did not reach out / i betrayed you / i treated you poorly, and you deserved this treatment, because you failed to know me well enough to know what i needed (even if i didn't know that myself)" ever again.

There's no failure in asking. But there's no failure in not asking either - because you might be dealing with your own shit, as a responsible adult does.

One school of phenomenology of empathy makes an interesting point that empathy is an aesthetic category, not a moral one - you don't really choose to feel it. But you can choose to show up for someone. You can choose to show up for yourself as well.

I have been dancing lately, and i think it's helping a little. Our tango teacher says semi-jokingly to followers (usually women, although i find occasionally following quite fun as a man) "if you teach men that you will do everything yourself, they will learn that" - meaning that they should not anticipate a move - if it is not being communicated clearly, it is not your job to guess it. On the other hand, leader's job is to very clearly suggest a move with a gentle push or a shift in their pose, but not force it. Ideally, that's a fun exchange of clearly expressed and contextually relevant suggestions and responses.

Re: My stages of learning to be a socially normal person

#235

Post by voidhorse » Tue, Nov 18, 2025, 5:11 AM UTC

fragmede wrote: post #8

stavros wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, in the timeline, this was after the author was bullied. Also, he says: > In essence, I became an example of obnoxious precocity, a heartfelt young wordcel. So it doesn't sound like disagrees with you either way.

It's all in the preamble before the later sections of learning and my implicit point was that my social awkwardness got better when I stopped trying to show off how smart I am. It still comes out occasionally, and I don't try to be condescending, so I do really appreciate my close friends when they give me feedback when I am. My other point though is that as people using AI to generate content take the time to tell C…

I don't know or care about the LLM use, but you are spot on about the egotism. This person is just like every other "i'm smarter than you and I have to show you that, see me, appreciate my intelligence! reward me for knowing things!" insufferable goon I've ever encountered, myself included. One day the author might realize that healthy, social relationships, "connection", stem from actually giving a shit about people who aren't me myself and I, but some people never get there.

Re: My stages of learning to be a socially normal person

#236

Post by tibbar » Tue, Nov 18, 2025, 5:12 AM UTC

boricj wrote: post #161

tibbar wrote: post #138

This resonates. I spent many years going hard at `5: Connection is about projecting love and acceptance`. I focused on providing unconditional acceptance to everyone I met, inviting them to share their burdens and listening empathetically and supportively. People often left our conversations thanking me for the "therapy session." And in many ways I think this was a positive energy to bring to the world! But eventuall…

> And in many ways I think this was a positive energy to bring to the world! Or in other words, becoming the landfill of negative energy of the world. As someone who used to be that person for over a decade, having people endlessly confiding their relationship/health/mental/work/legal/family/gender issues will over time completely wreck your sanity. Because when you're that someone, people will not just tell you the…

Oh, certainly. And if you have any resources besides attention - money, or social capital, for instance - people will happily take those too. It's not that they are wrong to ask, but the need is truly infinite, and no one will create guardrails for you except yourself.

Re: My stages of learning to be a socially normal person

#237

Post by voidhorse » Tue, Nov 18, 2025, 5:13 AM UTC

hcta wrote: post #76

fragmede wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's all in the preamble before the later sections of learning and my implicit point was that my social awkwardness got better when I stopped trying to show off how smart I am. It still comes out occasionally, and I don't try to be condescending, so I do really appreciate my close friends when they give me feedback when I am. My other point though is that as people using AI to generate content take the time to tell C…

Trying to show off how smart one is is probably part of the motivation behind many interesting comments posted on here, and more generally, a big motivation behind a huge number of the useful things people do. Doing it in a non-obvious way requires additional ingenuity. The cumulative effect of people trying to show off how smart they are has undoubtedly greatly accelerated the development of our species.

I can almost guarantee that the number of people who have made substantive scientific contributions to society were far more interested in their chosen object of study than they were with their perceived intelligence. I can think of a few, perhaps, but that number is slim.

Re: My stages of learning to be a socially normal person

#238

Post by makeitdouble » Tue, Nov 18, 2025, 5:14 AM UTC

1shooner wrote: post #219

etangent wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> a lot of the points felt more like learning how to charm, manipulate, and game social interactions. A lot of stuff "normal" people do is charm, manipulate, and game social interactions. Except because they are not conscious about it, we give them a pass. One of the characteristics of autistic-spectrum individuals is that they must make a conscious effort to achieve goals that are achieved unconsciously by most of u…

>A lot of stuff "normal" people do is charm, manipulate, and game social interactions. Except because they are not conscious about it, we give them a pass. One of the characteristics of autistic-spectrum individuals is that they must make a conscious effort to achieve goals that are achieved unconsciously by most of us. I have to say this strikes me as a very distorted perception. I don't know about 'normal,' but a s…

I read parent's wording of "manipulation" as not in the usual negative connotation, and more as making the other person do something specific.

For instance if you wanted a security guard to help you find your way in a shopping mall, there would be approaches that are more effective than others. For instance making it sound more like you have something important to do and they'd save your day by helping isn't specially abusing the person. They might feel pretty good about helping you, it's still somewhat part of their job so you're not tricking them either.

Re: My stages of learning to be a socially normal person

#239

Post by gblargg » Tue, Nov 18, 2025, 5:16 AM UTC

etangent wrote: post #72

Aurornis wrote: post #47

This post wasn't what I was expecting from the "socially normal" title. While there is a lot of self-reflection and growth in this piece, a lot of the points felt more like learning how to charm, manipulate, and game social interactions. Look at the first two subheadings: > 1: Connecting with people is about being a dazzling person > 2: Connecting with people is about playing their game The post felt like a rollercoa…

> a lot of the points felt more like learning how to charm, manipulate, and game social interactions. A lot of stuff "normal" people do is charm, manipulate, and game social interactions. Except because they are not conscious about it, we give them a pass. One of the characteristics of autistic-spectrum individuals is that they must make a conscious effort to achieve goals that are achieved unconsciously by most of u…

What comes across as creepy about the techniques is that the approach doesn't seem to involve personal consequences; it seems to be sterile, like a game with no negative effects if it goes wrong. Normal people have all sorts of anxiety and potential hurt if they do these things, since they know how they affect others.

Personally I'd prefer that "spectrum" individuals just be themselves. I take it as my own shortcoming if I can't establish a dialog. I like the challenge of interacting with someone who does things very differently. This of course assumes there's a genuine desire to connect. I knew someone who had some techniques like this, and it was weird interacting with him. The techniques put up a barrier and it didn't feel authentic.

Maybe I'm jaded but I see it as a failure of the "normal" person if they can't deal with someone who communicates differently. All their issues just get triggered, not the fault of the spectrum individual, and not their responsibility to overcome. As a practical measure for just dealing with these people, I could see using techniques. But not when you actually want to relate with someone.

Re: My stages of learning to be a socially normal person

#240

Post by hekkle » Tue, Nov 18, 2025, 5:18 AM UTC

epolanski wrote: post #216

Author's problem is that he tries too hard, which is off putting. The way to connect with people is to genuinely care about them and listen. The world is full of the oddest people who have normal relations because they simply care. The author seems to show very little empathy or care towards other human beings, in fact the entirety of the article sounds like connecting is all about himself. Me, me and me. How people…

I'm glad it wasn't just me who noticed this. It seems like the author doesn't care at all about other people; only about how to manipulate people into liking them.

Gives real narcissist vibes.