Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Apple loses UK App Store monopoly case, penalty might near $2B

9to5mac.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

231–240 of 411 posts

Re: Apple loses UK App Store monopoly case, penalty might near $2B

#231

Post by tucnak »

criddell wrote: post #180
ocdtrekkie wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know, but when every single business on the planet has to pay you 30% for access to mobile device users, it definitely isn't.

Why do so many people quote the 30% number? Only apps with more than $1,000,000 annual revenue are paying 30%. Most apps are smaller than that and are hit with a 15% fee.

I think you should aggregate by app installs, not distinct apps. The apps to make most impact, are most-installed apps. What if my app blows up to a tune of 1.2 mil? I'll be paying 400k Apple tax just because that's why?

Re: Apple loses UK App Store monopoly case, penalty might near $2B

#232

Post by vladvasiliu »

thisislife2 wrote: post #216

> “developers were overcharged by the difference between a 17.5% commission for app purchases and the commission Apple charged, which Kent’s lawyers said was usually 30%.” > “The CAT also ruled that app developers passed on 50% of the overcharge to consumers.” And that's why I stopped buying Apple products - ultimately it is the end user that pays for everything. Apple exploits both developers and its consumers.

In which situation does the end user not pay for everything? Even a fine or a tax on a company ends rolled up in the price paid by the end user. Same thing with programs paid for by the government. It’s the taxpayers who foot the bill.

I’m kinda split on the whole Apple situation. I’m firmly in the camp of “monopoly bad”, but apparently people are fine with apple’s practices. It’s not like they have to buy an iPhone.

Re: Apple loses UK App Store monopoly case, penalty might near $2B

#234

Post by potwinkle »

europeisdoomed wrote: post #103

how can I sue Google and Apple for not letting me change my device’s MAC address (Pixel and iPhone) and internet companies for leaking my IP addresses for tracking my internet activity or to track me. Does it violate GDPR requirements?

What are you talking about? Both iPhones and Android let you spoof your MAC address to a random or fixed value if you want, for privacy.

Also, "leaking my IP addresses" how the fuck do you expect a website to talk to you without an IP address to send the data back to.

Re: Apple loses UK App Store monopoly case, penalty might near $2B

#235

Post by shuckles »

bmandale wrote: post #214
shuckles wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Consider Google Play, for starters.

Google play has a dominant market position as well and is presumably next for this sort of ruling

Wow sounds very comparable yet notably omitted from the ranges the tribunal considered. Sounds like you agree with me that they just made it up? Or are you saying that it's fair to exclude the app store of an open platform which has plenty of "free market" competition from side loaded and 3p distribution apps because ~vibes~?

Re: Apple loses UK App Store monopoly case, penalty might near $2B

#236

Post by hvb2 »

scarab92 wrote: post #228
isodev wrote: post #223

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why the UK specifically? The App Store monopoly is driven by its world-wide presence, I think it should be global revenue, and a fine to match.

Because the fine amount is specific to the harm done by one product line, in one market. Whereas Apple’s profit figure reflects their total profit across all products and all markets combined. It’s meaningless comparing these, because it’s not an equal basis of comparison.

Why? You probably know just how long these cases take, so it is not like all other countries are now going to do the same.

If that's the case then using their total profit seems the only proper measure. What it says is that these companies lose these cases but it's so infrequent that they can just price it in. It's a cost of doing business.

If we were to fine Tim Cook 1000$ for doing something that paid him 1M would that have the 'effect' of keeping him from doing that again?

Re: Apple loses UK App Store monopoly case, penalty might near $2B

#237

Post by eviks »

vladvasiliu wrote: post #232
thisislife2 wrote: post #216

> “developers were overcharged by the difference between a 17.5% commission for app purchases and the commission Apple charged, which Kent’s lawyers said was usually 30%.” > “The CAT also ruled that app developers passed on 50% of the overcharge to consumers.” And that's why I stopped buying Apple products - ultimately it is the end user that pays for everything. Apple exploits both developers and its consumers.

In which situation does the end user not pay for everything? Even a fine or a tax on a company ends rolled up in the price paid by the end user. Same thing with programs paid for by the government. It’s the taxpayers who foot the bill. I’m kinda split on the whole Apple situation. I’m firmly in the camp of “monopoly bad”, but apparently people are fine with apple’s practices. It’s not like they have to buy an iPhone.

In a situation where profits decrease instead of price increase

Re: Apple loses UK App Store monopoly case, penalty might near $2B

#238

Post by bitpush »

Devasta wrote: post #57
bitpush wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This question is valid only if Apple lets apps host their own apps, bring their own payment system. Apple bans all such activities, has held the entire app ecosystem and seeks rent. If they think their offering is superior, then they should be OK competing. The fact that they have not opened it up says that they are happy to overcharge. Remember, competition is always good. Let Stripe and Apple duke it out on payment…

Hardly always good. The mobile app ecosystem on both iOS and Android is a morass of freemium games and ad slop, because the market has determined that hooking one whale is more important than creating a quality product. The competition will find the most profitable process, not the one that serves customers best necessarily. The biggest change the iPhone users are going to see an increase in spyware. They'll also not…

On Macs, users can download and install apps freely from the internet, and that platform isnt "a morass of freemium games and ad slop".

Why is that for one platform, everything needs to go through AppStore while the other it is OK - and both are equally secure?

Are you sure you're not falling for Apple's reality distortion field?

Re: Apple loses UK App Store monopoly case, penalty might near $2B

#240

Post by rkomorn »

bitpush wrote: post #238
Devasta wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hardly always good. The mobile app ecosystem on both iOS and Android is a morass of freemium games and ad slop, because the market has determined that hooking one whale is more important than creating a quality product. The competition will find the most profitable process, not the one that serves customers best necessarily. The biggest change the iPhone users are going to see an increase in spyware. They'll also not…

On Macs, users can download and install apps freely from the internet, and that platform isnt "a morass of freemium games and ad slop". Why is that for one platform, everything needs to go through AppStore while the other it is OK - and both are equally secure? Are you sure you're not falling for Apple's reality distortion field?

Not OP, and not that I buy that the App Store serves its purpose given what's currently on it, but I just don't think the two platforms are comparable.

iPhones outnumber Macs something like 10:1. The user base tech literacy is lower on average. The usage habits are different.

The payoff for creating freemium and ad slop stuff on iOS is way higher.

Post reply on HN