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The Future of the Vim Project

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Re: The Future of the Vim Project

#231

Post by yjftsjthsd-h »

rgoulter wrote: post #142
OJFord wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, why should I? I don't need a reason not to do everything, by default I'm not doing things, it's changing from status quo that requires a reason.

It's easier to maintain one codebase than to maintain two forks. If development of vim dropped and neovim was nominated as its successor, I'd think most vim users would be just fine.

> It's easier to maintain one codebase than to maintain two forks.

Not necessarily; if the two codebases are maintained by groups of people with incompatible ideas about how the code should work and what it should do, then keeping things separate is much easier.

> If development of vim dropped and neovim was nominated as its successor, I'd think most vim users would be just fine.

Agreed; they don't diverge that much from an end-user's perspective.

Re: The Future of the Vim Project

#232

Post by redrobein »

earth2mars wrote: post #198

Why so many people love vim? I have a genuine question. I was trying to delete contents of a file and paste new content. It was nightmare for me to remember the 3 or 4 finger combination shortcuts with small and cap letters involved during the process. I like if the shortcuts using Ctrl or shift or Alt or Command or Windows buttons over 3 finger with caps changing keys. The cognitive load in remembering shortcuts is…

> I was trying to delete contents of a file and paste new content. It was nightmare for me to remember the 3 or 4 finger combination shortcuts with small and cap letters involved during the process.

Vim rarely uses multi key combinations like emacs or most other editors do. Copying and pasting involves some knowledge of how the copy registers work. It can feel confusing when you first try it, but you figure it out eventually...

> Please give me a genuine opinion and justification. Does it really makes someone that productive?

The best way I can explain this is that vim is language. The process of editing in vim involves speaking this language. And once you're used to it, this language itself helps you reason about and execute editing tasks faster. It's also faster because the commands are very concise, and imo pretty easy to remember because they are mnemonics for the operations they perform. Imagine a task like selecting a string in quotes and changing it to something else with a mouse. In vim that's . c(hange)i(nside)"(doublequotes). Performing this is as instant as having thought about it.

Re: The Future of the Vim Project

#233

Post by yjftsjthsd-h »

oblio wrote: post #20
tokai wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>better if they merge You and meitham are very focused on this, but it is very much an opinion and not a fact.

It is an opinion backed by watching Open Source projects for several decades. Long lived forks are rarely good for an individual project. Frankly, the most successful forks I've seen unfortunately... kind of strangle off the original. Jenkins/Huson, LibreOffice/OpenOffice, MariaDB/MySQL, ConsoleZ/Console2/... Though there are cases where the original wins out: Emacs/XEmacs, etc. Especially since it's not like Vim/Neo…

There are also cases where the fork is caused by differences in philosophy and result in divergent codebases that are perfectly fine doing their own things, like NetBSD and OpenBSD.

Re: The Future of the Vim Project

#234

Post by Tyr42 »

rokizero wrote: post #137
bombcar wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have no worry about the funds being lost. It’s just imagining my heirs having to contact and close fifty+ accounts.

Serious question: How common is having dozens of accounts? I live in NL and have 3 at the same bank. Why would anyone have 50+ accounts?

Sign up bonuses. Some give an extra few percent on interest when you sign up, so you move all your money in, collect, then close the account out and go to another bank and repeat.

Re: The Future of the Vim Project

#235

Post by sonofhans »

chasd00 wrote: post #86
kqr wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm lucky enough to never have been put in this situation, so please excuse my ignorance: why does someone need to be able to sign in to my accounts when I'm no longer?

When my father in law passed away his wife asked me to get some photos on a thumb drive for her. I knew his password from watching him login, I also went ahead and deleted his browser history.

The real hero is always in the comments. That was very humane of you.

Re: The Future of the Vim Project

#236

Post by tambourine_man »

rgoulter wrote: post #128
tambourine_man wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From what I remember, NeoVim drops vi compatibility mode. vi is part of POSIX. That alone would be a reason to mantain Vim as a modern superset of vi.

In what circumstances would you run `vi` and find yourself upset that you end up in `vim`?

You won’t, but vi is scriptable and part of POSIX.

It’s a basic infrastructure that you don’t want to break.

Re: The Future of the Vim Project

#237

Post by gpvos »

bondant wrote: post #193
ritzaco wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I get the same on firefox with ublock origin, but it works if I turn off ublock or use chrome. on my android firefox, I can't load any google properties - it just redirects to a help page about how to clear my cache (clearing the cache doesn't help)

I had no problem browsing that page with firefox a few hours ago, but it's not working anymore. So yes, maybe the servers handling google groups are a little too busy.

It's showing for me now, so apparently there was some kind of temporary problem, maybe busy servers indeed.

Re: The Future of the Vim Project

#239

Post by causi »

I keep a couple of m-discs in my gun safe encrypted with a password most of my family knows, but they don't know the safe combination. If I kick the bucket they can cut the hinges off in a few minutes with my angle grinder. They could also use my corpse's finger to unlock my phone but that's a bit morbid.

Re: The Future of the Vim Project

#240

Post by throwaway290 »

massysett wrote: post #212
fortunateregard wrote: post #17

What is it that prevents the rest of the vim community from adopting neovim? From what I can observe, a great deal already have. But for the folks holding out, what is it that outweighs all that neovim has to offer?

My Vim needs are very modest. I just don’t need anything Neovim has. It’s complication I don’t need. If Vim got no new features, I wouldn’t care. If Vim became unmaintained but still available from distributions, I’d still use it. If Vim became unavailable (e.g. due to lack of maintenance) I’d be more likely to switch to nvi than Neovim. I could probably switch to nvi now, but I have no reason to.

FWIW you can use Neovim like Vim with your existing config, without any of the other stuff. That made the switch easy for me. Of course this means you'd rely on Neovim maintainers honoring that compatibility in future...
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