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I stopped buying new laptops (2020)

solar.lowtechmagazine.com

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Re: I stopped buying new laptops (2020)

#231

Post by DeathArrow »

Miraste wrote: post #138
edflsafoiewq wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is not what he means by "Laptops don't change". He means > A 2015 research paper discovered that the embodied energy of laptops is static over time. > Improvements in functionality balance the efficiency gains obtained in the manufacturing process. Battery mass, memory, and hard disk drive mass decreased per unit of functionality but showed roughly constant totals per year. > New laptops may be more energy-effic…

2015 was the nadir of processor improvements. At that point, Intel had effectively used the same processor in every laptop since 2008. I would like to see this analysis post-Ryzen and Apple Silicon.

Well, go to Geekbench and compare CPUs from 2015 with CPUs of today.

Re: I stopped buying new laptops (2020)

#232

Post by kibwen »

rospaya wrote: post #114
kibwen wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> a few years ago battery life was maybe 7 hours and now it’s 18 At what point do battery improvements become completely unnecessary? Who's out here using their laptops for 18 hours continuously? It's like an electric car that can go 2,000 miles on a single charge; YAGNI. The vast majority of people would be perfectly well-served by a smaller, lighter, less expensive laptop that cuts down the battery to just 10 hours…

> At what point do battery improvements become completely unnecessary? A week of heavy CPU/GPU use, on full brightness. We should strive for better. I want to go on a trip without carrying my charger.

This is asking for a battery with hundreds of times more capacity, which, regardless of any future advancements in battery tech, would result in laptops with batteries which are hundreds of times heavier, hundreds of times more expensive, and using hundreds of times more materials than they could otherwise be (to say nothing of being hundreds of times more dangerous in the event of a battery failure).

Re: I stopped buying new laptops (2020)

#233

Post by shortrounddev2 »

rpcope1 wrote: post #12

> Most of the 160-200 million laptops sold each year are replacement purchases. The average laptop is replaced every 3 years (in business) to five years (elsewhere). 3 My 5.7 years per laptop experience is not exceptional. This is one of the many aspects I don't like about how laptops are designed today. Even with OEM desktops like my Dell Precision T1700, it's still serviceable and fixable today without a whole lot…

My T420 is still running strong 12 years later. I don't use it for much since I'm not on Linux anymore, but I occasionally open it up and play with it. I'm using a Dell Inspiron now and I'm hoping it lasts a while.

Re: I stopped buying new laptops (2020)

#234

Post by HWR_14 »

Crywastaken wrote: post #151
ImPleadThe5th wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think there is nothing wrong with investing in equipment. I think there is something wasteful with replacing a laptop every year. Unless its some crazy jump in hardware between cpu/gpu generations that you weren't in sync for.

You can sell your mac every year then upgrade don't cost full price

If everyone insists on new hardware, then there is no one to sell your used Mac to.

Re: I stopped buying new laptops (2020)

#235

Post by datavirtue »

kibwen wrote: post #83
redroyal wrote: post #37

“Laptops don’t change” Really? because a few years ago battery life was maybe 7 hours and now it’s 18. And with faster processors, thunderbolt 4 and USB C charging, wifi 6, better screens and lighter. I keep hearing this argument for not buying a new laptop every year and it just doesn’t hold water. I say buy the latest MacBook, expense it, factor it in as a monthly cost. These are expendable and essential tools. The…

> a few years ago battery life was maybe 7 hours and now it’s 18 At what point do battery improvements become completely unnecessary? Who's out here using their laptops for 18 hours continuously? It's like an electric car that can go 2,000 miles on a single charge; YAGNI. The vast majority of people would be perfectly well-served by a smaller, lighter, less expensive laptop that cuts down the battery to just 10 hours…

You need an 18 hour battery to get a solid, reliable 10 hours of use.

Re: I stopped buying new laptops (2020)

#236

Post by vel0city »

redroyal wrote: post #203
quadrifoliate wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This. I lose any hope for us as a species being able to reverse climate change if the top comment about an article that goes quite deep into meaningful ways to “reduce, reuse, recycle" is that this is virtue signaling, and that we should buy Macbooks every year instead because they are "expendable tools". Guess what, their impact on the environment is very much noticeable. There is no way we are going to reverse or e…

That issue can’t be solved by reusing laptops or sorting cans from cardboard. The argument that every little helps is totally flawed. Fantasy, make believe. The other 8 billion people simply don’t care and why would they? 50 years from now they’ll all be dead. Since when did people care about future generations and the good of humanity? It’s a very recent western fashion. The only thing that truly motivated the vast…

There's 8 billion people so my actions don't matter. I guess I'll pour all my old paint and paint thinner down the storm drains. Maybe my motor oil and used coolants as well. After all I'm just one person out of 8 billion, my actions don't matter.

I'll just litter all my stuff as well. Single use plastics? Sign me up, I'll just throw it out in the street. I'm only one of a few million in my city, my actions don't really matter.

Or maybe my actions really do matter.

Re: I stopped buying new laptops (2020)

#237

Post by 2h »

andrekandre wrote: post #217
2h wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I keep hearing this argument for not buying a new laptop every year and it just doesn’t hold water. I say buy the latest MacBook, expense it, factor it in as a monthly cost. this is why Apple is a trillion dollar company. because people mindlessly buy any new thing they put out, regardless if it makes sense or not. https://youtube.com/watch?v=Ydje1ivynIM

> this is why Apple is a trillion dollar company. because people mindlessly buy any new thing they put out, regardless if it makes sense or not. not to defend apple or anything but whats the complaint here?... that apple is really good at capitalism?

> whats the complaint here

Its dont mindlessly buy any new thing Apple puts out

Re: I stopped buying new laptops (2020)

#238

Post by datavirtue »

user_7832 wrote: post #176
stetrain wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

18 hours advertised is usually running a locally stored video file on loop at medium to low screen brightness and some light web browsing. My 18-hour laptop is more like 8-10 hours of real work usage, which is still fantastic compared to the 2-3 hours I would get at similar tasks 6-7 years ago. Another big change is improvements to sleep and standby time. I can use half the battery, close the lid, and be reasonably c…

> My 18-hour laptop is more like 8-10 hours of real work usage, which is still fantastic compared to the 2-3 hours I would get at similar tasks 6-7 years ago. I’m not sure if you’re using an M1/2 MacBook but if you’re using windows laptops - 2 to 3 hours is pretty poor even for an old laptop (assuming it didn’t have an H series processor which is a whole another story). My (dad’s) HP Probook with its 6th gen i5 proce…

Never had a windows laptop that would last more than three hours...brand new or remanufactured. And I have used a LOT of windows laptops in my time, both used and new.

Except for the Lenovo Thinkpad X, or whatever they called it. I think I got ~8 solid hours of use out of them.

My 2022 MacBook Pro easily goes all day and into the evening under heavy use.

Re: I stopped buying new laptops (2020)

#239

Post by lotsofpulp »

bloomingeek wrote: post #226
flangola7 wrote: post #211

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is lazy defeatism and an immediate disqualifier I use in the selection of both friends and employees.

I agree, all branches of science should invent ways to recycle almost anything. We know we have a waste problem, yet society doesn't demand enough to have ways created to deal with recycling. Forget Mars and looking at the Titanic till we find ways to deal with real world problems. Burying our heads in the sand will hurt future generations!

The evidence indicates that recycling is burying our heads in the sand.

It is reduce>>>>reuse>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>recycle.

As far as I can tell, very little recycling actually ever happened or does happen. It was always just poorer countries willing to look the other way and trash it and claim it was recycled.

Re: I stopped buying new laptops (2020)

#240

Post by anthk »

redroyal wrote: post #155
benj111 wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So you buy a new laptop every year? What do you do with your old one? Throw it away? Or sell it? If you're selling it who do you think is buying it? You do realise most people don't need the fastest processor, an 18 hour battery life, thunderbolt 4 or WiFi 6 And better screens and lighter weight are relative. If I upgrade my 10 year old laptop to a 5 year old laptop I'm still realising those gains. Next year a better…

Well in 5 years I expect most dev work will be done in VR collaboratively with remote teams, w multiple virtual screens and AI assistance. Another world. Laptops and cell phones will be gathering dust with the desktops. Things change fast. Remember the world without the iPhone? That was 16 years ago. So when you talk about using a 5 year old laptop to save a few dollars it just doesn’t make sense. You can listen to m…

VR sucks for work. And multiple virtual screens... FVWM did virtual desktops since... 1994?
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