Live data from Hacker News

Svalbard is as close as you can get to a place with open borders

thenation.com

231–240 of 270 posts

Re: Svalbard is as close as you can get to a place with open borders

#231
post #190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's full freedom of movement, so it's an open border. The Schengen zone is no border.

it’s not an “open border”. on the contrary. there are actual physical borders between schengen countries and the rest of the eu. whenever you enter/exit schengen you have to pass border control.

If your passport shows you're an EU citizen, you're allowed to enter. So it's an open border for EU citizens.

Re: Svalbard is as close as you can get to a place with open borders

#232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>the places with the strictest border controls are often those that are quite desirable cheeky counterexample: North Korea

Pay a bit of money in China and you'll have a visa in no time. That's doesn't work with, say, Switzerland, at least not with a similar amount of money.

Most countries (including Switzerland) have some form of investor's visa which is basically an official way to pay for a visa.

Re: Svalbard is as close as you can get to a place with open borders

#233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having driven all over both MD and WV, both in cities and country. they are _very_ different. I also think that Belgium and Australia are very different in many ways, but they're also on opposite sides of the earth, whereas, as was pointed out, MD and WV share a border. I've also been all over NY and VA and would say they are more similar compared to the WV vs MD comparison. I'm not sure where you saw that NY is the…

I recently visited WV and I found it an interesting contradiction. A lot of the major infrastructure I saw was in perfectly fine condition, even quite good in many places. But in a lot of the little towns the poverty was palpable. Houses in such an amazing state of disrepair with patches cobbled on top of patches. Then you drive into the hills around the town and sooooo beautiful, big houses on big plots of land, etc…

The puzzle piece you are missing is topography. Load up a topo map of the state sometime. Nearly all of it is a twisted, practically fractal landscape of hills/mountains.

And unlike some other regions known for mountains (like New England) there are no (relatively) wide valleys between them.

It's wild, beautiful, and absolutely awful for building even a decent sized town in. It's why the few cities in the states are at the far edges, and even they are hilly. It's also obviously terrible for building transport infrastructure to get anywhere quickly.

Re: Svalbard is as close as you can get to a place with open borders

#234

I think the degree to which open borders are a reality within the U.S. is under-appreciated. As a reminder, U.S. states are sovereign entities with their own criminal laws, tax regimes, educational systems, property and contract rights, civil rights, economic growth, industries, natural resources, etc. In some cases their laws are pre-empted by U.S. federal law, but there remains quite a bit of diversity. Despite thi…

> U.S. states are sovereign entities with their own criminal laws, tax regimes, educational systems, property and contract rights, civil rights, economic growth, industries, natural resources, etc.

States can hardly be considered sovereign entities anymore. They are subservient to federal laws, educational standards, international trade restrictions, environmental protections, etc. States aren't even allowed to leave the federation.

Re: Svalbard is as close as you can get to a place with open borders

#235

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oregon and Washington are an interesting case. Washington has the most regressive tax system in the US. Oregon is one of the least regressive (yeah, all states are regressive). You would think that wealthy folks would really want to move across the river to escape Oregon's income tax. The problem, though, is that there are just two bridges across the river and they are frequently very busy, and 99% of everything is o…

The issue is washingtonians working in oregon would pay oregon tax. Tax applies if you work in the state not if you live there. Living in portland and working in Washington is the best bet if you can pull it off

Unless something has changed very recently, you pay Oregon income tax if you live here or work here. To avoid it altogether you would have to both live and work in Vancouver.

(until 5 years ago I lived in Portland and worked in Vancouver)

Re: Svalbard is as close as you can get to a place with open borders

#236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I recently visited WV and I found it an interesting contradiction. A lot of the major infrastructure I saw was in perfectly fine condition, even quite good in many places. But in a lot of the little towns the poverty was palpable. Houses in such an amazing state of disrepair with patches cobbled on top of patches. Then you drive into the hills around the town and sooooo beautiful, big houses on big plots of land, etc…

The puzzle piece you are missing is topography. Load up a topo map of the state sometime. Nearly all of it is a twisted, practically fractal landscape of hills/mountains. And unlike some other regions known for mountains (like New England) there are no (relatively) wide valleys between them. It's wild, beautiful, and absolutely awful for building even a decent sized town in. It's why the few cities in the states are…

That is an excellent point. The topography makes it beautiful, but now that you mention it, I can see how it would make building an expensive hassle.

Re: Svalbard is as close as you can get to a place with open borders

#237

Antarctica too: if you can get there, you can step onto the ice. There's a pattern here: the only places with open borders are places where you wouldn't really want to live anyway, while the places with the strictest border controls are often those that are quite desirable.

[deleted]

Re: Svalbard is as close as you can get to a place with open borders

#238
People who want to live on Mars could start by showing self-sufficient in Svalbard or Antarctica first. I assume it would be far easier because of the ideal gravity, protection from radiation, atmosphere and water. Manufacturing everything required would still be challenging.

Re: Svalbard is as close as you can get to a place with open borders

#240

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For me. I'd love to see open borders, where everyone has the freedom to move to where they can achieve their goals and dreams, rather than being restricted to the country where they happened to be born. How many Einsteins have been born in Africa, but denied the chance to make the contribution to humanity that they could have? (And before the cynics note that open borders are incompatible with welfare states, that's…

How many non-Einsteins from Africa and Asia would want to move to Western countries if given a chance? a few hundred million? A billion? How does a say Germany or France support a couple hundred more million people all at once? I think open borders is inherently a call for decreasing standards of living for the populations of those countries where most of the migration would be directed to. I just can't picture a sce…

Given that a whole lot of Western non-Einsteins moved to Africa/Asia as colonizers, looted and killed everything they could, stripped those countries bare and used that loot to build infrastructure in Euro-America, perhaps they should return the money they took with interest and no one will want to come.
Post reply on HN